Special Run Beretta M9 Project

[LockedBreech]

Well I learned a thing today


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[Trooper224]

Hex head screws became a thing on firearms for reasons of aesthetics. Hobbyists didn't like it when the slots on their grips screws failed to line up nice and pretty. The result was hex head grip screws. Combine that with the fact that too many people seem to think gun screws need one hundred foot pounds of torque applied to them and the outcome is all too routine. If a new gun has them, they're one of the things that gets replaced first. Of course, try telling this to members of the various fanbois forums and you'll think you've just slapped someones mamma.

[Larry Sellers]

Hex head screws became a thing on firearms for reasons of aesthetics. Hobbyists didn't like it when the slots on their grips screws failed to line up nice and pretty. The result was hex head grip screws. Combine that with the fact that too many people seem to think gun screws need one hundred foot pounds of torque applied to them and the outcome is all too routine. If a new gun has them, they're one of the things that gets replaced first. Of course, try telling this to members of the various fanbois forums and you'll think you've just slapped someones mamma.

"clocked" screw heads drive me insane, but I know they're more serviceable and there for a reason.

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[Hambo]

Zero fucks given on grip screws, but one of these is mine.

[Jared]

This ^^^^^

And I'll second or third, whichever it is. I see a LOT of broken bolts. Hex bolts almost always break the head clean off and leave the shaft in place. Conventional bolts and screws do it too, but not a consistently, and they're just as likely to break the shaft, depending on the installation and load.

ETA:. I change the hex head screws on Berettas out for slotted screws mainly for the field expedient tightening, rather than the strength.

[MSparks909]

Well I learned a thing today


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Me too!

[OlongJohnson]

Absolutely serious. The tool hole passes through the head, just into the shaft of the screw, This makes the juncture between the screw head and the shaft inherently weaker than a slotted screw. I've seen more than a few broken by over tightening.

This shouldn't be a problem with screws that are made to an industrial standard, such as DIN 912 or ASTM A574, where the head design is well-vetted by a lot of engineers before anything is ever released.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....l=1#post627816

You start to run into problems with custom fasteners where the designers are chasing a cosmetic objective before mechanical integrity, and then manufacturing it with inferior methods, typically a screw machine.

Beretta provides a perfect example of this with the screws they use to hold the plastic Picatinny rail section on the 1301 Tactical. The socket cavities appear to be drilled round holes to a sub-diameter, then the points of the hex are peeled downward (like a banana peel, but inside rather than outside) and stay curled up in the bottom of the hole. The original drilled hole has to be deeper than the final cavity to make room for the peels, and as described above, you can have failures due to the remaining section getting way too thin. It doesn't help that the outside of the taper is turned, leaving circumferential grooves (stress risers), rather than forged to a smooth surface with proper grain flow.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....l=1#post564014

Howa 1500 bolt stop screws, which are the only problem I'm aware of with that rifle, are a similar story of poorly-conceived, variably-manufactured custom hardware.

[LangdonTactical]

Hex head screws became a thing on firearms for reasons of aesthetics. Hobbyists didn't like it when the slots on their grips screws failed to line up nice and pretty. The result was hex head grip screws. Combine that with the fact that too many people seem to think gun screws need one hundred foot pounds of torque applied to them and the outcome is all too routine. If a new gun has them, they're one of the things that gets replaced first. Of course, try telling this to members of the various fanbois forums and you'll think you've just slapped someones mamma.

100% true ^^^^ But what some of you may not know, it is easier to assemble a gun with the hex head screws. Think about it, less chance of "screwing up" both the grip and the screw. I have seen both damaged in assembly. It is very easy to set up a power driver to limit torque and much easier to cross thread a screw with a flat head screw driver. In the end, it is a little cheaper to use the hex head screws.

[OlongJohnson]

Torx or inverted Torx ("E" or star-shaped heads) are quite a bit better than hex. Automotive is moving that way for a lot of things, and motorcycles even more (check out a KTM).

[Jared]

Torx or inverted Torx ("E" or star-shaped heads) are quite a bit better than hex. Automotive is moving that way for a lot of things, and motorcycles even more (check out a KTM).

Torx, in my experience, is a bit easier to get out if the ends get rounded a bit from over torquing as well. One of my absolute nightmare scenarios is trying to get hex heads that have been rounded out removed when they're torqued down hard and the heads are recessed. It usually involves a drill and a lot of patience.

Gun related, I had one of the hex screws on a 92 rounded out one time. That one I wound up using a Dremel tool with a cut off wheel to make a slot in the head and then using a screwdriver to get it out. The majority of scenarios in my professional life do not play out that we'll.