Shoot / No Shoot Drills

[ScubaSteve]

Hi All,
I'm a new(ish) rangemaster and have just been put in charge of planning and running our future ranges. We are a small Sheriff's department in Northern California. I'm looking to progress our range training from teh mostly static shooting we do and am looking for ideas. I would like to do something different for target identification (shoot/no shoot.) Looking for more of a scenario based drill. We have the typical photo targets with the different pasters (gun, badge, cell phone) Do any of you all have any recommendations?

Any other drills/courses of fire that you found especially engaging or helpful?

Thanks,
Scuba

[psalms144.1]

Scuba - the paste on photo targets with changeable hand contents are decent for turning targets, or if you have the ability to set up a "Hogan's Alley" kind of range run where the trainee has a very limited amount of time to target discriminate.

If I was going to dedicate time to decision making/target discrimination, etc, then force on force is the vehicle I would use. I'd specifically use Airsoft, since it can minimize the amount of safety gear the student needs to wear and less bulky protective gear for the role player, all of which allows the trainee to see and assess better.

The tricks to successful force on force are several:

1. Well planned and scripted scenarios
2. Emotionally mature role players who understand it's NOT their job to "punish" the students
3. Focused post-scenario debriefs that are BRIEF, private, and intended to reinforce lessons the student learned for themselves (which will happen is 1 & 2 are done properly)

[jnc36rcpd]

We've done Hogan's Alley courses of fire. It works well as long as officers waiting for their run can't figure out where the shoot/no-shoot targets are.

I do agree with psalms that force-on-force is the preferred decision-making training methodology.

[heyscooter]

Assuming you're already doing FoF and other judgement based training (e.g. any of those simulators that are scenario based), here's a cost effective measure that I bought to use doing range time. Pretty easy, self explanatory, and cheap: https://www.patriotstencils.com

Bought the basic set, I run shooters through a super limited stress course at the end of a range day. When I say limited I mean I only have a one way range that doesn't give me a ton of options, but it helps with some basic drills. I already have paint cans and basic targetry, so it makes it easier. Even if you don't have USPSA/IDPA targets to use, you can take any cardboard target and use the backside.

Like I said, I don't think this replaces deep dives in judgement based shooting concepts, but it helps any shooter that has some sort of baseline.

[JustOneGun]

All good ideas.

If you are a typical LEO department and are allotted minimal time, then it is often advantageous to also emphasize dryfire. Some will do it if it is short and sweet in duration. Teaching/Re-teaching how to do it properly is beneficial. Suggesting they use a target for presentations is advantageous IMO. I think a lot of LEO's practice draws with no target by just bringing the pistol up to a comfortable level. I.e. it is done sort of half way.

Shoot/Don't shoot doesn't have to be super high tech either. A slide presentation on a laptop where it randomly gives the shoot/don't shoot can be a good idea if the deputies have access to blue gun. This is great if you don't have a FATS or in addition to it. For AOT you can use that type of presentation as a poor man's FATS with live fire if you project it onto a piece of plywood. Obviously you will be out a piece of plywood after it is shot up. If the department is small enough that is sometimes workable. Make your own videos of people drawing a wallet, cell phone, gun, knife, etc. Making multiple videos of the same person in the same place drawing something, starting to draw something and then quickly surrendering with hands up. Sky's the limit.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Here's a nice presentation on airsoft usage in FOF. https://www.krtraining.com/KRTrainin...rceOnForce.pdf

They also run a FOF instructor course, granted that is in TX. But Karl might have suggestions. Psalms144.1 hits the major points. I've been through the airsoft with Karl and paintball with my campus department. Maturity on all sides is interesting. Some folks get angry when they lose. Esp. if they think they are hot stuff. Since I'm a FOG, that never bothers me. The old NTI ran us through some great civilian scenarios. Did I lose one of them! Ouch.

[voodoo_man]

FoF with sims is really the only real way to do this type of target discrimination training effectively.

It can be done with standard targets, it just requires changing of the targets each time as the guys running through the drill will talk and figure out which are which on their own.

[ScubaSteve]

Thanks for all of the reply's. We don't do nearly enough force on force training bu I am hoping to do more in the future. Got some paintball setups and a couple of airsoft guns.
For now I think I will just set up a hogans alley type course. The range we use is set up so I can separate the Deputies who have shot and those who have not.

Our range program is sad to say the least. I took over about three months ago and am trying to get the guys to the range at a minimum of every three months. Before, it was once a year if we were lucky. A change in admin helped but its still hard to do. Just trying to get everyone up to speed before we move into anything more advanced.

At the moment we have 6 Deputies and 2 Sgt's on the street. With ultra low staffing levels its hard to get admin to give up the overtime to do any extra training. I've hit all the points of liability and post audits but it is an uphill battle. I imagine I'm preaching to the quire.

Thanks Again
Scuba

[Erick Gelhaus]

Force on Force training and simulators are excellent for working the judgmental side of the problem. Sometimes though, you need to be able to throw those drills in to live fire. The problem with most is that you / other instructors are telling them what to do (shoot) rather than letting them ID the threat and work through the problem ... "Triangle, 3 rds, go!"

The last time we had Scott Reitz up, he showed us one that, by consensus, we like for doing judgmental / live fire. Aside from the shooter(s), you need a bank of three targets for each shooter, and a roll of blue painters tape.
- After making ready, Shooter is facing uprange while you set up the targets;
- Using the blue painters tape (it stands out on every paper target we've used), we mark the targets or leave them blank;
- On the go command, shooter turns around and deals with the target bank.
- No blue tape = No Shoot, one piece = head shot, 2 pieces = pair to the chest, 3 pieces = Failure Drill.

A FEW keys ... Don't make every target a failure drill or even a shoot. Preferably, only one target is a shoot target. Don't put the tape all together, spread it out on the paper. You've no doubt read Wayne & Darryl talking about their concerns of needlessly muzzling unknowns or no shoots. To address / reinforce that, put the tape down low & make the shooter LOOK for it. We now have turning targets at work. I really like running this drill on turning targets.

Given that you are in the PRC, you have POST's perishable skills program to whip out of your pocket. As part of the 24 hours of CE training every two years, your coppers have to have 4 hours of firearms & 4 of arrest/control. We make a full day out of it by doing range time, mat time, and then scenario training.

[UNM1136]

One dirty little trick I did when I put on a shooting on the move class a few years back is spray paint a (legible) number on each target, and then you can call out numbers or simple math problems (2+3=shoot #5). You can also decree that even numbers are always no shoots for a run, or always failure drills for a run. I got railed by a Master Instructor for making my movements too linear, but for a bunch of folks who had never shot on the move before, it was a really nice intro. I also don't see why you can't do a Zig Zag Drill plattern, while making them think and then engage specific targets.

I have also read all of Paul Howe's stuff, and like the tape drill above I used tape or 3x5 index card to signify no-shoot targets. I looked at the class and noted where each wore/carried a badge regularly, so I taped an index card left chest, or centerline chest, or right belt, or left hand, or right hand. I made sure that every one saw a badge in a spot they wear it either on or off duty (we are a small department). On a couple I even put the 3x5 outside the photo of the target, but on the paper and close to the photo, so if you were scanning the entire person first you would see the card, and if you were just scanning the hands you usually shot when you saw the gun, and maybe before the debrief you would realize that you were shooting faster than you were processing information. Even if the the photo target has a gun in thier hand or a mask on, the "badge" equaled a no shoot target, and you really had to look at the entire person to determine if it was a no-shoot. We had access to a shoothouse then, and each shooter was given instructions before entry. You could tell quickly who was looking at the entire target, and processing it, and who was just looking at a standard qualifcation target and shooting.

A current drill that we are running with our M&P transition is that each shooter (2 on the line per relay) face up range and draw a card from a deck of cards. They look at their card and memorize it and give it to the instructor. The instructor then takes two cards of the same color and three cards of the opposite color, and tapes them to the target randomly. On the go signal the shooters run from the 7 to the 25 and back, and at the 7 yard line draw and shoot thier card, for a number of rounds equal to the face value of the cards. Then they engage the two cards of the same color with round equal to each of their values. Then if they have rounds left they may engage to three other colored cards. You will need instructors calling out hits and misses, particularly if you don't rehang targets before starting. Because the cards are assigned randomly, you can have an easy run, or a tough run, but most of them seem to even out. So you are IDing targets, shooting them, and following through before deciding what target to go to next. Under time pressure, and with a little physical exertion. You would be surprised how many fives and sixes of different suits with holes in them were seen being hung on and in people's lockers in the days/weeks following the transition class. You also would not believe the "with it" shooters who rushed thier shots, and ended up losing to technically less proficient shooters who took thier time, saw what they needed to see, and made good shots.

Just a couple of thoughts.

pat