Beretta 92D With Updates

[Noah]

So…. Is the Cougar about to become the latest P-F hipster gun?

People have been crying for a PX4 revamp and metal frame versions of poly guns are so in right now...

It's been right in front of us the whole time...

[JonInWA]

I'm a little, no, color that a lot more skeptical. Todd Green and I had some pretty detailed discussions about the Cougar, and I personally had an 8357 which I had obtained BNIB, presumably an override from the North Carolina production run.

It's a gun that I really wanted to like; the ergos were quite nice, and I was intrigued by the potential of the rotating barrel/cam tooth concept, particularly regarding higher intensity/energy/pressure spiking cartridges, like .357 SIG and .40.

Unfortunately, if frankly just didn't work all that well in reality with .357 SIG and .40. Both NH HP (.357 SIG) and Utah HP (.40) divested themselves of their Cougars well before they approached their forecasted end of use lifespan. There were significant extraction issues that were never successfully resolved, particularly with .357 SIG, despite repeated BUSA engineering/re-engineering efforts. If the guns were not properly and continuously lubricated, in relatively short order during firing sessions they would seize up, and couldn't be further operational until the reciprocating metal parts cooled.

Concurrently, I suspect that there was very little, if any advantages derived from the rotating barrel with 9mm; .45 ACP, I'm not sure, but LAPD, who authorized a special longer barrel version of it specifically produced for them was much more predisposed to the Glock G21, as it was lighter, had a greater magazine capacity, had lower maintenance requirements, and was more weather impervious (and presumably was far less expensive regarding the guns, magazines, spare parts and armorer training, and required far less time for maintenance protocols).

Interesting gun, very nicely made, but kind of like the WW1 experiences the Canadians had with the Ross rifle, which failed miserably in the gauntlet of real world use.

Its successor, the PX4 has fared much better. As a hipster, dilettante pistol, the Cougar has its charms, but for actual use, there are far better choices, in my opinion.

Best, Jon

[MattyD380]

I'm a little, no, color that a lot more skeptical. Todd Green and I had some pretty detailed discussions about the Cougar, and I personally had an 8357 which I had obtained BNIB, presumably an override from the North Carolina production run.

It's a gun that I really wanted to like; the ergos were quite nice, and I was intrigued by the potential of the rotating barrel/cam tooth concept, particularly regarding higher intensity/energy/pressure spiking cartridges, like .357 SIG and .40.

Unfortunately, if frankly just didn't work all that well in reality with .357 SIG and .40. Both NH HP (.357 SIG) and Utah HP (.40) divested themselves of their Cougars well before they approached their forecasted end of use lifespan. There were significant extraction issues that were never successfully resolved, particularly with .357 SIG, despite repeated BUSA engineering/re-engineering efforts. If the guns were not properly and continuously lubricated, in relatively short order during firing sessions they would seize up, and couldn't be further operational until the reciprocating metal parts cooled.

Concurrently, I suspect that there was very little, if any advantages derived from the rotating barrel with 9mm; .45 ACP, I'm not sure, but LAPD, who authorized a special longer barrel version of it specifically produced for them was much more predisposed to the Glock G21, as it was lighter, had a greater magazine capacity, had lower maintenance requirements, and was more weather impervious (and presumably was far less expensive regarding the guns, magazines, spare parts and armorer training, and required far less time for maintenance protocols).

Interesting gun, very nicely made, but kind of like the WW1 experiences the Canadians had with the Ross rifle, which failed miserably in the gauntlet of real world use.

Its successor, the PX4 has fared much better. As a hipster, dilettante pistol, the Cougar has its charms, but for actual use, there are far better choices, in my opinion.

Best, Jon

Yeah, I remember hearing that Todd was not a fan of the Cougar. Like I said, I also encountered some problems with that .45 Cougar I had. But, after slathering the action in copious amounts of grease, I have to concede that may have been the issue. I remember it shooting fine for a while... then, after I shot another gun... the action felt kinda sluggish and kerchunk-y. I'm guessing that _hit congealed in the action while the gun cooled. In any case... after 100 rounds and a fresh coat of oil, this 9mm Cougar seems to work fine. Not that 100 rounds is a lot.

The biggest difference I can see between the Cougar and PX4 is the lug pattern. The Cougar has thinner "fins" that slide into narrow channels machined into the slide. The PX4 uses more of a "lobe" shaped primary lug that mates with broader contoured areas inside the slide. I could see how excess crud/sludge might cause more of an obstruction with Cougar's design. But who knows... I know nothing of engineering. And I will second Jon's perspective that the Cougar feels like an extremely high-quality piece of machinery. Sturdy, heavy and dense.

In any case... sorry for the thread drift. This discussion is about DAO Berettas.

I'm happy with the way this one shoots. The G10 grips arrive tomorrow. I may also experiment with some lighter chrome-silicon hammer springs--not that it's heavy, as is. But... you know...