Split times

[breakingtime91]

I really liked how Robert Vogel addressed this in his recent interview. He said (very close) "Look what really happens. There are a lot of dash cam videos out there these days. What do you usually see? You usually see the officer who just got shot at pulls the gun and shoots as fast as he can. Ideally we should shoot as fast as we can hit the target but when it goes south like that most people shoot as fast as they can. So the question is do you train to shoot as fast you can?"
That is why split times matter

There are also a lot of misses during those fights. The guys that are truly successful (good hits, put the threat down fast, and do this on multiple occasions) see their sights (in some manner), get good solid hits, and don't dump a lot of rounds. That is why I started this thread, there are multiple ways to look at this. I can completely understand why people shoot really quickly at close ranges but when you read AAR of truly successful gun fighters, they tend to not do that.

[Tamara]

How many of the officers in the dash cam videos were hitting the range three times a week?

Most convenience store gunfight footage shows clerk and perp engaging in one-handed gunfights, half turned away from each other, with their off hand up to protect their faces. Should I be practicing shooting that way?

Who am I supposed to be modeling myself after?

[JHC]

I think training to see more, faster, makes all of that appear slower--at least that's what my training in competitive and defensive scenarios has shown.

And training to control recoil and track sights at the .20 split and faster level to hit an 8" circle at 7 yards translates into a slowing of perception of a gunfight to enable hitting tight targets, probably moving while avoiding collateral damage? Bear with me but I do not see the connection. I see the connection with experience and precision capability but not with GM level splits.

[breakingtime91]

And training to control recoil and track sights at the .20 split and faster level to hit an 8" circle at 7 yards translates into a slowing of perception of a gunfight to enable hitting tight targets, probably moving while avoiding collateral damage? Bear with me but I do not see the connection. I see the connection with experience and precision capability but not with GM level splits.

That is why I find this so interesting. I think being fast has merit but if I wanted to train for what I may realistically encounter: it needs to be highly accuracy driven at varying distances, practice shooting a lot on the move, and probably transitions since bad guys travel in packs.

[cheby]

That is why I find this so interesting. I think being fast has merit but if I wanted to train for what I may realistically encounter: it needs to be highly accuracy driven at varying distances, practice shooting a lot on the move, and probably transitions since bad guys travel in packs.

Yep.
All of these you would train shooting USPSA. It is awesome

[JHC]

Yep.
All of these you would train shooting USPSA. It is awesome

Many distinguished gunfighters have agreed with that. But how big a deal are splits in that mix? (OP original question) Pretty minor across a 20-30 second stage.

[breakingtime91]

Yep.
All of these you would train shooting USPSA. It is awesome

No one said anything bad about USPSA, calm your pants. I shot with Peally last month (great shooter btw) and even said to him how fun shooting USPSA style was and how it tested my skills. Did you take this thread as anti competition?

[breakingtime91]

Many distinguished gunfighters have agreed with that. But how big a deal are splits in that mix? (OP original question) Pretty minor across a 20-30 second stage.

Yup, which I think is the interesting thing. Competition is great but how big of a deal are faster splits and is there a point where it no longer matters.

[JHC]

No one said anything bad about USPSA, calm your pants. I shot with Peally last month (great shooter btw) and even said to him how fun shooting USPSA style was and how it tested my skills. Did you take this thread as anti competition?

Games be one of the coolest ways to learn and push limits of what you can do while moving IMO.

[JHC]

Yup, which I think is the interesting thing. Competition is great but how big of a deal are faster splits and is there a point where it no longer matters.

I've seen many an experienced martial shooter or analyst point out the incredibly high correlation between a fast dead nuts center punch hit with ultimate victory. First shot. YMMV