Essential Kit For A Carbine Class

[Jared]

I'm not familiar with those, just from the tactical side. We are issued them at work for low and hi-pro quick response to go from office business casual to "repelling boarders" in seconds.

Chance, you could look at the gear made by TYR Tactical or HTC. Just go to the their websites and look for Velcro inner or outer belt systems. The idea is that you wear a belt through your pants belt lools that has Velcro on the outside. The second belt has Velcro on the inside, and carries your gear. The idea being that when you get to class, you can slap it on and go from nothing to all your gear in seconds, and it's secured in place from bouncing around d with the Velcro mating to the inner belt (unlike a traditional battle belt). Same with doffing the gear to hit up lunch or drive home. You can do it as a low-profile option or have the outer belt be a battle belt type setup if that's what you prefer.

It's totally not needed, just something that some people prefer due to the convenience.

That's exactly how the gamer belts work.

I wonder now, honestly, where they originated. I'd honestly never heard of anything similar being used on the tactical side of things, but I'm a bit out of the loop about all the various gear out there

[JSGlock34]

I've taken a VTAC Brokos battle belt with a couple of HSGI pistol and rifle TACOs, and the aforementioned Safariland 6004, to a few classes. I like the TACOs as you can use them with a variety of magazines.

I've also just used my regular Raven Concealment rig with a Bladetech AR15 carrier or two.

[Casey]

That's exactly how the gamer belts work.

I wonder now, honestly, where they originated. I'd honestly never heard of anything similar being used on the tactical side of things, but I'm a bit out of the loop about all the various gear out there

That's pretty much the standard LE duty belt setup in the US. Some use a plain trouser belt and outer belt secured by belt keepers, others use hook or loop covered trouser belts mated to loop or hook lined duty belts.

Chance - in the one carbine class that I've taken, I ran a Velocity Systems OUB/Ares Gear Mil Duty Belt with Safariland 6360, Tactical Tailor dual pistol mag pouch, two SORD rifle mag pouches, single HSGI Taco for a handheld light, and an 1110 Gear pouch holding my trauma kit. I had a lightweight chest rig with me, but two mags on the belt plus one in the gun was more than enough given the low round count in an entry level class, so the chest rig stayed in the car. The belt was set up to mirror the rig I was wearing at work at the time (security at a commercial nuclear site).

If I was starting from scratch and didn't have a particular need to train with any sort of duty rig, I would probably just buy an ALS or Raven OWB holster, an HSGI Taco/Raven Moduloader magazine carrier setup, put them on a stiff belt (Ares Aegis Enhanced), and call it a day. No real need to go getting all jocked up if you're not training for a specific occupational need.

[HCM]

That's pretty much the standard LE duty belt setup in the US. Some use a plain trouser belt and outer belt secured by belt keepers, others use hook or loop covered trouser belts mated to loop or hook lined duty belts.

Chance - in the one carbine class that I've taken, I ran a Velocity Systems OUB/Ares Gear Mil Duty Belt with Safariland 6360, Tactical Tailor dual pistol mag pouch, two SORD rifle mag pouches, single HSGI Taco for a handheld light, and an 1110 Gear pouch holding my trauma kit. I had a lightweight chest rig with me, but two mags on the belt plus one in the gun was more than enough given the low round count in an entry level class, so the chest rig stayed in the car. The belt was set up to mirror the rig I was wearing at work at the time (security at a commercial nuclear site).

If I was starting from scratch and didn't have a particular need to train with any sort of duty rig, I would probably just buy an ALS or Raven OWB holster, an HSGI Taco/Raven Moduloader magazine carrier setup, put them on a stiff belt (Ares Aegis Enhanced), and call it a day. No real need to go getting all jocked up if you're not training for a specific occupational need.

This. Though I would skip the moduloader and just use belt mounted tacos.

[schüler]

Chance, Paul is a KISS guy as you know. From what I've seen he's still working from plate carrier and single strap drop (ALS/DFA/QLS) with a G19. Heck he still Co-Flexes his TQs to carbine stock. I don't think he cares as long as it works well. What does the class gear recommendation say?

For me, shooting from prone is not fun with a front loaded belt or especially duty/battle belt. Feels like you're a draped over a low curb. Can affect prone elbow elevation and neck angle. I'd run as slim as possible up front, maybe pushing mags more to side. Slimline double mag pouch or even single pouch. A pair of rifle mag pouches behind.

For rifle mags I've used a pair of affordable Safariland 774 w/Tek Lok mount behind pistol pouch. Teks are easily sized to most solid belts and can be positioned where you want. Not a Taco fan. I don't think Esstac make a 5.56 Short with KYWI for belt?, but I loved them on a plate carrier or chest rig.

Changing from AIWB to 3 o'clock or so is going to be interesting. In your train up to Oct I expect you will commit to EDC that way as well. Might make sense to work out a suitable OWB/IWB holster with your regular carry pistol and be done with it.

I'm not sure why G34 and 21rd mags are needed? Go as light as possible. At day's end you'll still feel like you're taking 30lbs off at the end of the day. Don't add to it.

Keep retention in mind both in the sprint portion and going prone to standing. Also consider weather compatibility/accessibility with your holster and other choices. We had snow at February pistol class there.

[Cookie Monster]

I am no expert and not high speed and mainly pistol but I ran both an AR and AK through Thunder Ranch Urban rifle with mags in my back pockets.

Med kit on my ankle.

Keep it light and simple, knee pads are great, wear then under your pants.

[Drang]

Subscribed.
I am hoping to take a carbine class this year. I plan on saying something like "Everything I know about the M4 I learned in the Army... in 1980."

I picked up a PIG chest rig when SKD had them on sale a few weeks ago, I figure for a grab and go hanging in the closet next to my M4gery, it should be... OK.

But I've been debating a battle belt, and would probably hand out many likes to those who post photos of how to assemble one...

[JSGlock34]

The nice thing about chest rigs is that you don't really have to assemble anything, and they're cheaper than piecing together a battle belt. Like many here, I owned one of the SKD PIG's predecessors, the Paul Howe inspired Eagle UCR, but man, eight magazines is way too much for me, and the SKD's retention design wasn't great for downloading. I don't usually reach for a chest rig, but when I do it doesn't carry more than four magazines.

[rob_s]

I've written a lot about this over the years, but I still like this logic...

1) Know your role.
2) Know your instructor (and what they require).
3) Think of all of your gear combined as a system.
4) Establish what is your primary weapon and prioritize that gear.
5) Select other gear to work with your primary.
6) Layer your system based on your role.

Start with your carry gun in a holster that closely mimics your carry holster. Add 1-2 pistol mag pouches to the belt and 1-2 rifle mag pouches. Any class that requires more than that you should (a) reconsider why you are there and then (b) use a chest rig to back-feed the belt pouches as necessary and assuming the course is truly a good one for you. Not a plate carrier, a chest rig. Go light, compact, and small. The only thing other than ammo you should attach to it is *at most* a tourniquet. You'll be at a range, with facilities and places to leave your cool tool, your bandaids, and whatever else people use to ruin their chest rig. They will also already have an emergency plan and supplies should something happen to you. if they don't, you shouldn't be taking classes there.

ETA"
I helped design this one. It's still my favorite. Get it with the un-padded H-harness and have them omit the tie-down points on the front. You can skip the admin pouch too.

[Hizzie]

I ran HSGI tacos on a simple CR at CSAT. Arcteryx knee caps. Simple kydex owb holster. The carbine class wasn't high round count or very fast paced. Plenty of time to water and reload 28rds at a time. Odd for me since AK's don't need downloading. Paul's biggest concerns appeared to be pointing the gun in a safe direction and making your hits. He was pissed that we had a guy with issues seeing his sights all weekend and didn't speak up until the end.