http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/for...320-story.html
Some good points. Some unfounded complaints. Plenty to consider.
-The not so good side of plain clothes response to active shooters.
-Untrained officers that start to imagine things due to stress.
-Piecemeal response that has officer arriving in ones and twos, and not having an organized response.
-Antiquated radio equipment.
Whether you think you can or you can't, you're probably right.
Some things I noted:
1. As we have seen time and again, you are your own first responder.
2. That means you better be prepared to ditch your bags and skedaddle, know where to hide, or be able to fight when you're unarmed (I really need to work on the running and fighting parts!)
3. If traveling, always have a way to charge your phone on your person. A bottle of water is probably wise too.
4. Review your first aid training to make sure you recognize signs of dehydration, heart attack, shock, or even just low blood sugar. The paramedics may be held back by law enforcement.
Thoughts from a non-LEO - when an event like an active shooter is unfolding or, in this case, had unfolded and then ended in the first couple of minutes, people call the cops expecting professionals to show up and deal with the situation professionally. They don't expect panicked people in uniform screaming "shots fired" all over the airport when there were no shots being fired.
I've read repeatedly on this forum that LE training re: firearms is a big problem in both quantity and quality in most places. Is it safe to assume that there is a lack of training for these types of situations overall?
I'm sorry but I've got to just laugh...
Every single big event like this is going to be a complete and utter cluster fuck. That's just how it goes and there isn't a damn thing which can be done to stop it.
Years ago I responded to an officer getting shot in the vest during a vehicle stop and that turned into a pursuit which turned into locking down an area to search for a suspect.
Everyone and their mother showed up. Different departments, feds, I was plainclothes and was randomly stopped so much (even though I didn't fit the description) that I started wearing my vest on the outside of my shirt. First were reports of several shooters, then one, then several again. Descriptions out the wazoo of various suspects when there was only one and he was shot and killed two minutes into the ordeal in a back alley.
It took about an hour or so to clear everything up. That was only because a commander on scene told all non involved units to leave the area. Even then the feds still stuck around for a bit because they don't have to listen to him.
Remember the Boston bombing suspects search? That was a cluster and a half, though the movie skips around a bunch, they shot at their own guys!!
Anyway, reporter is just pointing out stuff that isn't new or needs changing, that's just how it is, and the best advice is not to show up unless you are directly responsible for that area or requested to go. If that's your department and you are working, yep get there. If your two towns over, listen the band and assist as needed. Feds will show up as always, but that's not something which can be stopped.
For the average Joe, if you are in a fucked up situation like this either stay with the crowd or get in your car and roll out. If you can't do either find the closest fat police officer with spaghetti on his hat and brass on his collar/shoulder and tell them you need to leave or where the safe spot is.
Just some quick info on plainclothes responding - every PD has them and every PD uses them differently. The recent DE barricaded guy saw plainclothes units going in first and they were engaged first, having to back out very quickly due to them not being adequately equipped for that type of operation.
We have a thread on non uniform guys only carrying a gun and nothing else when working, that's essentially what happens in these situations, dudes show up without a single piece of equipment only their pistol and nothing to ID them from a distance and they get called on.
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Seriously, thanks. It's understandable and not surprising but also something that needs to be said to everyday folks so we can have the right mindset about what to expect from all sides.Every single big event like this is going to be a complete and utter cluster fuck. That's just how it goes and there isn't a damn thing which can be done to stop it.
nevermind
Last edited by txdpd; 04-29-2017 at 11:04 AM.
Whether you think you can or you can't, you're probably right.
A summer or two ago, there was a shooting on the campus of UCLA. Initially, it was thought to be an Active Shooter event. Helicopter video showed LAPD, and others, going through a check-in and kinda/sorta dispatch proceedure. While no one could stop the confusion and mis-information, those in command were presented with better info and info flow by going that route instead everyone showing up and diving in.
Self-dispatching is a problem in the first responder world, it is a much bigger problem for L/E than Fire and EMS. I believe that is because they do such a good job at working within ICS and we flat out suck at it.
I understand the point about chaos happening. I don't disgree with that. We need to do a much better job at managing it from our side of the coin. What is really going on? Where? How many? Who? Then work your plans.
As much as I despise the media, I really can't disgree with this bigger picture concern.
I agree with VooDoo. And I really don't know if there is anything that can be done other than training everyone to Delta's standards and we all know that's not happening.
We do not use ICS, but a local reconfiguration of it. They (the brass) through policy and various hardware measures to stop such an issue. The thing is and once the train starts moving it is not going to be stopped.Originally Posted by Angus McFee
The biggest and best example of this I saw was when an officer was killed in broad daylight light about ten years ago and the description fits 90% of all males out and about.
When I say the train doesn't stop, I mean it did not matter what the orders were, every single person in a mile radius was getting stopped and held for ID.
That scene didn't get cleared up until well after midnight, probably fifteen hours after the fact. I worked twenty two hours that day straight, never put in for a minute of OT, no one did.
While it may be a concern in some respects, the fact is that most situations like this require a lot of officers, and you do not know how many until well into the occurrence. So in my opinion, limiting the number of responding for such a serious situation is asking for serious problems.
VDMSR.com
Chief Developer for V Development Group
Everything I post I do so as a private individual who is not representing any company or organization.
Shots fired, or not, I hate all of this yelling about it, on and off the air. Once upon a time, on duty, I fired one shot, immediately and devastatingly effective, and, sure enough, a colleague, who was present, got on the air and broadcast "shots fired!" Well, yes, Captain Obvious, I did fire a shot, but the one-and-only actor is going down, bleeding-out like a garden hose, with a hole to China through his sternum, and EMS was already on scene, standing by, so why all the excitement, and why exclaim it on the air? How about a simple "under control" over the air, so that units running hot can slow down?
Yelling "shots fired" seems to be genetically programmed into too many police recruits. (Not all, of course.) How about a breath, then a calm "I have a possible discharge of firearms to my N/S/E/W/whatever" on the air?
Last edited by Rex G; 04-29-2017 at 06:15 PM.
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