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Thread: Travis Haley SKIMMER Glock Trigger (Just Released)

  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by MEH View Post
    Yeah, my naming may not be perfect but the bottom line is that it looks like the firing pin safety is disengaged.
    I don't think the video necessarily shows that the fpb is disengaged. It does show that the drop safety is disengaged, which occurs when the pretravel is eliminated without modification of the trigger housing or the trigger bar.

  2. #132
    In my tests the drop safety is disabled but the firing pin block remains enabled.


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  3. #133
    Licorice Bootlegger JDM's Avatar
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    Disabling or potentially disabling any internal safety, especially one that safeguards a gun from discharge when dropped is a horrible idea. That is all.
    Nobody is impressed by what you can't do. -THJ

  4. #134
    Member VolGrad's Avatar
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    So I just watched the video. What I'm getting is the gentleman used a tool to manipulate the trigger bar thus causing the striker to release.

    Is this something that would happen in real life? Is this action directly corrolated with dropping the pistol on concrete?

    I have asked Jeff in the past (by e-mail) about this when these the M4C hive attacked the product. I seem to recall he stated the product had been drop tested with ZERO issues.

    Again, I'm not attacking the integrity of Mr. Jensen. I'm sure he's a fantastic guy with creds out the wazoo. I'm simply stating I'm not sure how much concern I'd have based on what someone was able to "prove" with the use of a tool.

  5. #135
    Butters, the d*** shooter Byron's Avatar
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    But when the internal safeties are all functioning 100%, even the tool should not be able to do that (as he illustrates in the control video).

    Whether or not this will result in an accident is a separate issue. What does not seem to be debatable, however, is that a Glock with fully-functioning internal safeties should not allow this.

    It would be the same as any function check before assembling the Glock. Sure, you could say, "well, I was only able to yaddayaddayadda with my finger." But that doesn't negate that an internal safety is no longer performing as designed.

    Also, whether or not it has withstood drop tests does not necessarily indicate whether or not the drop safety is functioning.

    If the issue is, "So-and-so says it is safe, and I take him at his word," then fine; that is the user's choice.
    But if the claim is, "So-and-so says that no internal safeties have been compromised, and I take him at his word," then the videos (and vandal's testing) contradict that, and further assurance of credibility does not change that.

    I have absolutely no dog in this fight. I just think that once the genie is out of the bottle, with a controlled, video-taped test contradicting manufacturer claims, we've gone beyond anyone's word. As JodyH pointed out, anyone can repeat these tests. If some Skimmers show this symptom while others do not, then there may be issues with out-of-spec units. If all of them display this behavior, then it would seem prudent for the maker to change their previous assertion that no internal safeties are compromised.

  6. #136
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    What the video proves is that the drop safety is not functioning as the factory intended. The gun is likely still drop safe, if the FPB is not engaged when the trigger is at rest. The Glock Trigger website claims "[o]ur modifications will in no way defeat the safety features provided by the Glock factory pistol." I don't see how this statement is consistent with the fact that the drop safety does not function as intended by Glock.

  7. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by joshs View Post
    What the video proves is that the drop safety is not functioning as the factory intended. The gun is likely still drop safe, if the FPB is not engaged when the trigger is at rest. The Glock Trigger website claims "[o]ur modifications will in no way defeat the safety features provided by the Glock factory pistol." I don't see how this statement is consistent with the fact that the drop safety does not function as intended by Glock.
    /thread

    Is there really any more to say? (I guess I'm going to say a little bit more.) Unless someone could prove that the video that Robb J was some how a fluke and atypical, I wouldn't go near a Skimmer trigger.


    1) It offers at best a marginal improvement over other mods.

    2) It's costs a lot.

    3) It may very well be less safe.

    Where's that link to the article that explains this sort of fanboyism? Something about we don't like to think we made a bad decision, so we defend goods we purchased despite obvious shortcomings.

    It's all great that the owner of the company personally told you that no safeties are compromised, but that video clearly shows a safety is compromised. If you feel a need to defend this trigger to others, I'd take as step back and ask myself why.

  8. #138
    Member VolGrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leozinho View Post
    Where's that link to the article that explains this sort of fanboyism? Something about we don't like to think we made a bad decision, so we defend goods we purchased despite obvious shortcomings.
    Ironic. Not a personal attack toward you Leozinho ... just a statement about the collective group. P-F.com (and ESPECIALLY M4C) is not immune to fanboyism from the top down. I think Todd's falling out with them a while back sort of shows the clique nature of that site. Just sayin'.

    M&P 9
    HK P30
    CCC Shaggy
    Garrity Invictus
    anything from Raven Concealment Systems
    various sight sets
    the "gadget"
    etc

    I'm not bashing by pointing that out. We all (myself included) get sucked in. Someone we know and trust recommends something we all jump on board to try it out. It happens.

    I'm don't really have much of a dog in the Skimmer fight other than I know Jeff personally. However, I don't own a Skimmer. I have no stake in the company. I don't know Travis Haley and frankly could take or leave him. In fact, I almost wanted not to like the kit in protest for past fanboyism directed toward Magpul during the Costa & Haley years. It's a turn off for some. All I can say is knowing Jeff I can say for me I trust he would never put out a product that he feels in unsafe in real world application (vs putting a tool though an opening that doesn't exist with the actual slide plate cover in place and moving parts around). I suspect one could disable lots of things that would never be disrupted doing that.

  9. #139
    Butters, the d*** shooter Byron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VolGrad View Post
    All I can say is knowing Jeff I can say for me I trust he would never put out a product that he feels in unsafe in real world application (vs putting a tool though an opening that doesn't exist with the actual slide plate cover in place and moving parts around). I suspect one could disable lots of things that would never be disrupted doing that.
    You keep minimizing what the test is showing.

    Again, function checks simply check that everything is functioning. They are not meant to replicate real-world conditions. When I take the slide off my Glock and check that the firing pin safety is still working, that's not meant to replicate the actual conditions that would require the firing pin safety.

    This function check showed that the drop safety is disabled. That contradicts the manufacturer's written statement about this product. That is worrisome for some people.

    Plenty of firearms that don't feature a drop-safety have been safely dropped before. Just because a drop-safety is disabled does not mean that the gun will fire every time it's dropped. But that doesn't change the fact that in this case, the drop-safety is disabled.

    One of the reason Armorers use those slide plates is specifically to perform certain function checks. Deriding the result as some sort of anomaly that can only happen under those specific testing conditions is missing the point. And no, using that slide plate and a punch on a normal Glock doesn't "disable lots of things that would never be disrupted"

  10. #140
    Seeing as I do have the Skimmer in my parts drawer I think I should try pistol whipping a desk with it to see if I can get the trigger bar to drop. Not that I do a lot of pistol whipping, but that would be about the max impact I would expect (more than just dropping the gun).

    I was going to put it back in a training gun anyway, primarily to see if it helps educate my trigger finger in finding the minimum reset point during rapid fire.

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