DA/SA Training

[SLG]

So this before you talk or walk thing sounds good, like tough street cop stuff. I'd never heard it before this thread, and it sounds like a common thing in some parts. However, it is my opinion that It doesn't address the correct way to decock, and it doesn't take into account any kind of effective training principles.

The correct way to teach decocking, is to have the student decock as soon as they begin to break down their mount. Trigger finger goes into a high pinned register, and then they decock. Every time, all the time. Tons of one and two shot drills will give the reps needed.

This way, the �� is always decocked before it gets back to the chest, sometimes called position three. When the �� passes position 2, and begins to rotate down towards the holster, the thumb goes on to the hammer. Every time, all the time.

You cannot allow any leeway for where the decock happens, nor the thumb, nor the trigger finger, for that matter, or people will fail to do the right thing through no fault of their own.

Safety manipulation on 1911s and M4s works in a very similar fashion. For that matter, so does locking your car door.

Nothing is foolproof, but this is the best way to achieve the highest success in this area. There is slightly more to it than I wrote out, but hopefully that will give people some idea of how to go about training it correctly.

[JAD]

S, do you decock during a reload? I don't safe, because I can't, but I would if I could. I do release the striker on my P7. I don't have enough TDA experience to know what I'd do with one of those.

[SLG]

S, do you decock during a reload? I don't safe, because I can't, but I would if I could. I do release the striker on my P7. I don't have enough TDA experience to know what I'd do with one of those.

You can't decock during a slide lock reload.

A tac load always occurs after decocking.

[rsa-otc]

So this before you talk or walk thing sounds good, like tough street cop stuff. I'd never heard it before this thread, and it sounds like a common thing in some parts. However, it is my opinion that It doesn't address the correct way to decock, and it doesn't take into account any kind of effective training principles.

The correct way to teach decocking, is to have the student decock as soon as they begin to break down their mount. Trigger finger goes into a high pinned register, and then they decock. Every time, all the time. Tons of one and two shot drills will give the reps needed.

This way, the �� is always decocked before it gets back to the chest, sometimes called position three. When the �� passes position 2, and begins to rotate down towards the holster, the thumb goes on to the hammer. Every time, all the time.

You cannot allow any leeway for where the decock happens, nor the thumb, nor the trigger finger, for that matter, or people will fail to do the right thing through no fault of their own.

Safety manipulation on 1911s and M4s works in a very similar fashion. For that matter, so does locking your car door.

Nothing is foolproof, but this is the best way to achieve the highest success in this area. There is slightly more to it than I wrote out, but hopefully that will give people some idea of how to go about training it correctly.

The bold above is QFT.

I believe whole heartedly in SLG's words above and strive to instill that in my students when teaching DA/SA, which right now boils down to my son and my daughter, LE and Military respectively.

That said. I recognize that under stress it doesn't always happen. After 3 years of running a S&W 3rd gen gun in the late 80's I took a John Farnam course and when they pulled me off the line of John's Dualtron course I had to be told to De-cock. This was after 3 years and 10,000's of reps. That shook me to the core and reinforced keeping my head in the game.

This was the same course that after not missing during the entire course; when it came to the final test I choked and missed the knock down target and then stared in disbelief. My success over the previous 3 days had programmed my mind set. Sometimes failure is the best teaching tool. We just need to make sure that failure is during training and not during an actual confrontation.

[David S.]

Talking and walking is cute. It gets much of the point across in a succinct manner. I hope it goes without saying, decocking should not be limited to just those two.

I prefer to view decocking positively, vs negatively (when can I decock, vs when do I have to decock). Decocking is fun. It's productive and safer. It's automatic, and doing things automatically makes me feel more operatory. I love decocking and do it as often as possible, particularly in high stress situations. Decocking is the best.

I'm being silly, but that's my basic decocking philosophy. I will take any opportunity I can to decock my gun. If my finger moves off the trigger to register position, the gun gets safed or decocked. The only exception I can think of off the top of my head is an emergency reload.

[Sauer Koch]

So this before you talk or walk thing sounds good, like tough street cop stuff. I'd never heard it before this thread, and it sounds like a common thing in some parts. However, it is my opinion that It doesn't address the correct way to decock, and it doesn't take into account any kind of effective training principles.

The correct way to teach decocking, is to have the student decock as soon as they begin to break down their mount. Trigger finger goes into a high pinned register, and then they decock. Every time, all the time. Tons of one and two shot drills will give the reps needed.

This way, the �� is always decocked before it gets back to the chest, sometimes called position three. When the �� passes position 2, and begins to rotate down towards the holster, the thumb goes on to the hammer. Every time, all the time.

You cannot allow any leeway for where the decock happens, nor the thumb, nor the trigger finger, for that matter, or people will fail to do the right thing through no fault of their own.

Safety manipulation on 1911s and M4s works in a very similar fashion. For that matter, so does locking your car door.

Nothing is foolproof, but this is the best way to achieve the highest success in this area. There is slightly more to it than I wrote out, but hopefully that will give people some idea of how to go about training it correctly.

Excellent!

This thread has been great. Is it just me, or is this worthy of becoming a sticky?

[Sauer Koch]

Talking and walking is cute. It gets much of the point across in a succinct manner. I hope it goes without saying, decocking should not be limited to just those two.

I prefer to view decocking positively, vs negatively (when can I decock, vs when do I have to decock). Decocking is fun. It's productive and safer. It's automatic, and doing things automatically makes me feel more operatory. I love decocking and do it as often as possible, particularly in high stress situations. Decocking is the best.

I'm being silly, but that's my basic decocking philosophy. I will take any opportunity I can to decock my gun. If my finger moves off the trigger to register position, the gun gets safed or decocked. The only exception I can think of off the top of my head is an emergency reload.

Again, excellent!

[KG]

There is slightly more to it than I wrote out, but hopefully that will give people some idea of how to go about training it correctly.

Thanks SLG. If you get a chance I'd appreciate hearing what the "slightly more" is.

[LSP552]

To build on what SLG said, the every time all the time also applies to dry fire. And this is where the disconnect happens for many. Every time you finish a dry fire string, move the decocking lever even though the hammer is down. Do the DA stroke, let the trigger out enough to simulate a SA shot, for as many as you wish. Then move the decocking lever at the end of the simulated SA shots.

Failure to move the decocking lever during dry fire actually trained you NOT to decock. And under stress you will do exactly that.

Decocking is an each and every time thing, live and dry fire.

If you do this, it doesn't take any more time to teach than taking your finger off the trigger and placing it in your register position.

[Cecil Burch]

To build on what SLG said, the every time all the time also applies to dry fire. And this is where the disconnect happens for many. Every time you finish a dry fire string, move the decocking lever even though the hammer is down. Do the DA stroke, let the trigger out enough to simulate a SA shot, for as many as you wish. Then move the decocking lever at the end of the simulated SA shots.

Failure to move the decocking lever during dry fire actually trained you NOT to decock. And under stress you will do exactly that.

Decocking is an each and every time thing, live and dry fire.

If you do this, it doesn't take any more time to teach than taking your finger off the trigger and placing it in your register position.

So 100% agree with this. It was something I did not do when I was running a SIG 2022 years ago, but since going to the P07, I made it a practice to dryfire it exactly the way SLG said - as soon as you break the firing mount. It
s easy to ass in, and builds a good habit with no negatives.