3 o'clock concealment draws from untucked shirt par times?

[LSW]

I was wondering if anyone had par times for IWB 3-3:30 carry from under an untucked shirt. I usually just wear a polo that's a size too big for concealment. I use the off hand lifting method.

I'm pretty slow. My par times to guarantee a down 0 hit on an idpa target:

5 yards 1.6
10 yards 1.9
20 yards 2.3

Dry fire 1.2 with only a trigger prep, no press a la steve anderson sight picture confirmation (using a 1/3 size target at 10 feet to simulate 10 yards)

Does anyone else use this kind of carry/concealment combo, and if so are there any tips/tricks to getting things down to 1.5 or less consistently? I'm using an M&P 2.0 9mm full size. I know I could probably shave .2-.3 by just going to AIWB but I'm chunky plus I play IDPA and like to practice for that too.

[Leroy Suggs]

Thats not all that slow from 330 concealment.

I have found using the strong hand to start the lift--both hands will be on the shirt- to be a bit faster and less fumble prone.

Can go pretty fast one handed using the strong hand lift too.

In my opinion it is crucial to be able to draw and shoot strong hand only from your draw protocol.

[YVK]

Thats not all that slow from 330 concealment.

That's what I thought too. Been ages since I did IWB but I think your times are very respectable.

I'd also point out that gear in IWB matters quite a bit. It is one thing to be digging a compact pistol out of VM2, and totally another to draw a full sized gun from kydex that lifts that gun 2 inches over the belt.

[Mr_White]

I was wondering if anyone had par times for IWB 3-3:30 carry from under an untucked shirt. I usually just wear a polo that's a size too big for concealment. I use the off hand lifting method.

I'm pretty slow. My par times to guarantee a down 0 hit on an idpa target:

5 yards 1.6
10 yards 1.9
20 yards 2.3

Dry fire 1.2 with only a trigger prep, no press a la steve anderson sight picture confirmation (using a 1/3 size target at 10 feet to simulate 10 yards)

Does anyone else use this kind of carry/concealment combo, and if so are there any tips/tricks to getting things down to 1.5 or less consistently? I'm using an M&P 2.0 9mm full size. I know I could probably shave .2-.3 by just going to AIWB but I'm chunky plus I play IDPA and like to practice for that too.

Wish I could tell you more specifically, and I did used to carry that way, but it has been a really long time and I don't think I had even seen a timer yet by that point. Off the top of my head, I think 1.5 is pretty strong. I know I've seen reports of draws in the neighborhood of 1.1 There's a good video of another member here: https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....l=1#post551416

Right before I switched to AIWB, I had been carrying in a Blade-Tech strong side IWB with open front cover and spent a bunch of time working on my draw. I was down to 1.2-1.3 seconds from that rig and concealment for a pretty reliable hit on an 8" circle/A-zone at 7 yards, IIRC. I remember the very fastest draw I saw on the timer from that arrangement was 0.99. That was ONE time and I don't think it was a hit. And it was a long time ago.

Your question kind of makes me want to dig a holster out of the closet and at least try out some par times in dry fire.

If you can post some video, I think people will be able to give a lot better and more specific feedback.

[ASH556]

I carry a G17 in a JM V3 at 3:30 under a polo. From my range session last FridayI was mid-1.4's to 1.5's at 7 yds to 8" circle and 1.7's to 7 yd 3x5.

[LSW]

I'm using a 10 year old comp-tac MTAC holster. It has a leather backing that covers most of the grip and slide where it would otherwise contact your side/undershirt with a kydex shell facing the belt and two C clips. Will try to con my wife into videoing me.

[OnionsAndDragons]

Tom Givens has one of the best concealed hip draw I have ever seen. I may try and find footage when I'm home.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Gio]

I typically run in the 1.0-1.2 range from an JM OWB2 holster concealed with a closed front T-shirt or polo and getting around 90-95% A zone hits on an open 7 yd target. I lift my shirt with both hands rather than just my weak hand as I find it much more reliable for a wide range of different types of concealing garments than trying to just use my weak hand, although just using weak hand can be a bit faster. Compare this to my open carry draw times, which range from about .75-.90 on the same size target. I will try to post some dry fire videos this evening if it would help.

[LSW]

Not the best angles I know, but I just had to try to set my phone on the bench. Give me your worst, my movements look very labored and jerky in the videos. Keep in mind every tailor I go to tells me I have freakishly long arms for my height.

5 yards: averaging about 1.68. 9 0's, 1 down 1. The down 1 was a messed up grip on the draw due to grabbing undershirt, ended up with half my finger through the trigger guard and it went high left into down 1 with a bad 1.83.




10 yards: averaging about 1.9, had 8 0's and 2 down 1's.

[Gio]

Not the best angles I know, but I just had to try to set my phone on the bench. Give me your worst, my movements look very labored and jerky in the videos. Keep in mind every tailor I go to tells me I have freakishly long arms for my height.

5 yards: averaging about 1.68. 9 0's, 1 down 1. The down 1 was a messed up grip on the draw due to grabbing undershirt, ended up with half my finger through the trigger guard and it went high left into down 1 with a bad 1.83.

It looks like you are moving inefficiently in my opinion. Two big areas you can clean up:
1. You are creating a lot of wasted movement with your strong hand before it goes to the gun. It almost looks like your strong hand comes away from your side before coming back in toward the gun. You want to make sure your hand moves straight to the pistol with no excess movement. See this still-shot from your video as an example:


2. After the gun comes out, you seem to roll/move your shoulders forward and lean forward before breaking the shot. Try to draw from the position you want to be in when the shot breaks so you don't have to adjust your upper body positioning after drawing.