Carry Optics loses the 10 round limit.

[CleverNickname]

Limited Optics is probably what it should have been from the start and where it's heading. It wouldn't surprise me if a year from now they make some kind of allowance for small compensators to allow Roland'esque rigs. Maybe a box to restrict overall size just to drive folks nuts.

I'd much rather see the ability to use carry-sized magwells. Not the big honkin' Limited or Open-sized magwells, but something that's still theoretically carryable. I don't know the best way to specify it, maybe a maximum width and length for the magwell, or maximum width more than the factory magwell? And making it so the gun still has to weigh under the 45oz limit will help to limit the size of the magwell somewhat.

[YVK]

2017 USPSA Optics Nationals just finished up. Carry Optics had 72, Open 183, and PCC 85 competitors.

I thought that there would be more. 2017 Single Stack Nationals has 390 spots, all full.

[taadski]

I thought that there would be more. 2017 Single Stack Nationals has 390 spots, all full.

When you consider, for example, the 2016 Open Nationals only had 170ish competitors (and another 30 or so in limited 10), perhaps the argument that the two new divisions are going to dilute the playing field isn't holding water? IDK. Between the two, adding another couple hundred competitors to this year's Nationals certainly isn't a negative thing for the sport.

Re the mag capacity thing, I'd much preferred they'd left the division "Production Optics" and maintained the 10 round limit. But that's just me being selfish mostly, being primarily a Production shooter and wanting to have stages break down similarly and to be able to compare results more cleanly. (shrug).

[Bart Carter]

I shoot CO because of my eyesight and it's what I carry. If there was no CO, I would just shoot open. I am not going to any national competition one way or the other.

[45dotACP]

Fairly impressive the difference between the top open shooter and the top carry optics shooter this year.

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[taadski]

Impressive that they were within 15%? Or impressive they weren't more behind the curve than that?

IME, there's a GIANT difference between a correctly set up open gun and and your random production pistol with an optic plopped on top. I think that Max shooting 86% of the open winner with a 320 is a pretty impressive feat. And gives us a pretty good look at the relative shootability of the two pistol types.

Special hats off to Hwansik for putting together such a solid performance too!

[YVK]

When you consider, for example, the 2016 Open Nationals only had 170ish competitors (and another 30 or so in limited 10), perhaps the argument that the two new divisions are going to dilute the playing field isn't holding water? IDK. Between the two, adding another couple hundred competitors to this year's Nationals certainly isn't a negative thing for the sport.

I was just ribbing GJM who keeps pointing out how PCC is the next big thing.

Re the mag capacity thing, I'd much preferred they'd left the division "Production Optics" and maintained the 10 round limit. But that's just me being selfish mostly, being primarily a Production shooter and wanting to have stages break down similarly and to be able to compare results more cleanly. (shrug).

They sort of had to. Five CO shooters at an Area match under old rules was kind of indicative. Now I see a little spike in interest that I hope will carry further. In fact, I myself am interested somewhat.

[theblacknight]

I'm a serious production shooter. Trying to make GM this year. Hated the idea of what "Production Optics" was trying to be and didn't like the people who first where pushing the idea acting like they were epic visionaries trying to light the way for the luddites.

As it stands right now, Carry Optics would be the only division I would seriously consider shooting for a "winter division". I've been shooting production for 5 years now and while I'm not going to any other division, the 10 round limit is now a lot like reloading ammo, the novelty is gone, it's just a chore now. Someone could get a 17 or 34 MOS, a RMR, 4 140mm magpul gmags and fucking do it up. Fuck any other division because of expense. I have no inclination to try to find enough 40 brass to make a run at Limited. I get brass for $free$ from my local range as they sponsor me. .40 brass is maybe 1/8th of the common duty calibers I get when I sort out everything else and take mah 9mm. 45 is more common then 40 right now. My agency just switched to 9mm locally also.


Calling Carry Optics "poverty open" or similar is very easy and trendy, but its a division where you can buy a off the shelf gun, loctite your red dot on, get some 140mm magpul mags and go. Is it really comparable to Open from a logistics and support stand point? What kind of powder do you need for your carry optics load? Its 9mm, you can use all of them. The same for Open? HELL NO. In Open, you have 9mm Kaboom and 38 Stupid. Your powder choice for 9mm major is limited and while 38 super is sweet on the gun and easier to reload, the brass is expensive. How much does a proper open gun cost x2 because if you shoot open, you either have 1 gun and don't care about finishing a major, or you do care and you have a 2nd gun.

Like was pointed out, even the fucking Europeans shoot 15 rounds per mag in production, and they are scared of guns! Hell, they have a lot harder stages in IPSC also, as Europeans are not afraid of higher accuracy and more stage movement.

[JCS]

Does anyone have a link to the Optic Nationals Scores?


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[GJM]

Does anyone have a link to the Optic Nationals Scores?


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https://practiscore.com/results/new/...q_individual=0

I'm a serious production shooter. Trying to make GM this year. Hated the idea of what "Production Optics" was trying to be and didn't like the people who first where pushing the idea acting like they were epic visionaries trying to light the way for the luddites.

As it stands right now, Carry Optics would be the only division I would seriously consider shooting for a "winter division". I've been shooting production for 5 years now and while I'm not going to any other division, the 10 round limit is now a lot like reloading ammo, the novelty is gone, it's just a chore now. Someone could get a 17 or 34 MOS, a RMR, 4 140mm magpul gmags and fucking do it up. Fuck any other division because of expense. I have no inclination to try to find enough 40 brass to make a run at Limited. I get brass for $free$ from my local range as they sponsor me. .40 brass is maybe 1/8th of the common duty calibers I get when I sort out everything else and take mah 9mm. 45 is more common then 40 right now. My agency just switched to 9mm locally also.


Calling Carry Optics "poverty open" or similar is very easy and trendy, but its a division where you can buy a off the shelf gun, loctite your red dot on, get some 140mm magpul mags and go. Is it really comparable to Open from a logistics and support stand point? What kind of powder do you need for your carry optics load? Its 9mm, you can use all of them. The same for Open? HELL NO. In Open, you have 9mm Kaboom and 38 Stupid. Your powder choice for 9mm major is limited and while 38 super is sweet on the gun and easier to reload, the brass is expensive. How much does a proper open gun cost x2 because if you shoot open, you either have 1 gun and don't care about finishing a major, or you do care and you have a 2nd gun.

Like was pointed out, even the fucking Europeans shoot 15 rounds per mag in production, and they are scared of guns! Hell, they have a lot harder stages in IPSC also, as Europeans are not afraid of higher accuracy and more stage movement.

I really enjoy Carry Optics, especially with the change to 140mm magazines. If you want to make GM, CO is not the division for you. The hit factors are crazy hard, and there is only one shooter in all of USPSA with a GM classification average, and that is only 96 percent.

https://www.uspsa.org/top20.php