Trucks

[rob_s]

Area 51 was a Bronco color. I don't know about Avalanche. I think the Mach 1 is 'fighter jet gray'. I think the Mach 1 is by far the best looking Mustang, I've done the build/price on it a couple of times but ultimately would rather have a new truck than a new sports car and I still really like my Camaro.

this is a hijack but...

I was just telling a friend the other day, these are the salad days of car design. So many current-production versions of long-running or re-booted vehicles are at best-ever levels. Not everyone will agree with all of them, but the 911, Corvette, Mustang, Bronco, Wrangler, Miata, F150, Grand Cherokee... so many are best-in-a-long-time if not best-ever. And many of the current versions are even just mild tweaks to the immediate preceding but the tweaks really nail it.

[BehindBlueI's]

this is a hijack but...

I was just telling a friend the other day, these are the salad days of car design. So many current-production versions of long-running or re-booted vehicles are at best-ever levels. Not everyone will agree with all of them, but the 911, Corvette, Mustang, Bronco, Wrangler, Miata, F150, Grand Cherokee... so many are best-in-a-long-time if not best-ever. And many of the current versions are even just mild tweaks to the immediate preceding but the tweaks really nail it.

I don't know anything about 911s or Miatas, so no comments on that. I'll agree but not delve into the Corvette and Mustang, and would add the Challenger/Charger and ZL1 Camaro. Non ZL1, I think the 5th gen nails the Camaro ethos better than the 6th gen, although the 6th gen is faster and more agile.

I disagree on the Grand Cherokee. They've been repositioning it up market/luxury that it's not really the same vehicle any longer. I think the outgoing Trailhawk and the now gone Trackhawk are the best ever Grand Cherokees. The new Trailhawk is PHEV only? I don't mind PHEV as a concept, but that's the wrong trim for it. For me, the previous generation was the best Grand Cherokee.

The F-150 is a very strong 'best of' contender for me. I have zero brand loyalty and have driven all of the Big 3 at some point, more GM/Chevy than anything, but it's a near certainty Ford is my next vehicle. Ram just isn't innovating and is falling behind, but pricing doesn't reflect that. I still prefer the Gen 4 to the Gen 5. Move up to the 2500, though, and the Power Wagon is definitely a 'best of' contender. Immensely capable as both an off roader and as a truck. Just a shame you can't get the bigger gas tank without going to the 8' bed, which when combined with the mandatory crew cab makes the truck something like two football fields and a volleyball court long...

Back to the 2023 MY for Ford:
Rumor was Ford was going to a Google/Android operating system in their infotainment for 2023, but that is not the case with the F-150s anyway. I haven't played with Sync 4, but I vastly prefer Uconnect or Android over Sync 3.

[rob_s]

Back to the 2023 MY for Ford:
Rumor was Ford was going to a Google/Android operating system in their infotainment for 2023, but that is not the case with the F-150s anyway. I haven't played with Sync 4, but I vastly prefer Uconnect or Android over Sync 3.

ford is weird as hell with their "Sync" versions. I'd honestly probably be driving an Explorer ST right now if it'd had the latest gen Sync when I was hot to buy one.

[BehindBlueI's]

ford is weird as hell with their "Sync" versions. I'd honestly probably be driving an Explorer ST right now if it'd had the latest gen Sync when I was hot to buy one.

I think the ST is compelling if you don't want/need offroad capability. SUVs are really a better value than trucks right now, as well, more for the money IMO. I just know/strongly suspect I would regret not having a truck bed at some point and hate the 'but trailer' argument. The aboslute last thing I want is yet another thing to find a place to park. I absolutely refuse to have to move one vehicle to get another vehicle out of the garage or driveway, and I will die on that hill. It was something I refused to compromise on when buying a house. No street only parking, no playing Tetris to park, no unpacking to get to any vehicle I want when I want it.

[rob_s]

I have a truck AND a trailer and even I don’t like the “but trailer” argument!

[mmc45414]

I think the ST is compelling if you don't want/need offroad capability.

I think the ST would be more of a fun car replacement that would be a year round daily, rather than a truck replacement. My wife just mentioned them the other day, as a potential alternative to the Bronco we want. I guess if we tripped over a used one it might be interesting, but a new one would flirt with sixty and the Bronco we plan should be low forties.

I just know/strongly suspect I would regret not having a truck bed at some point and hate the 'but trailer' argument.

I have a truck AND a trailer and even I don’t like the “but trailer” argument!

I think I would have a hard time being without a truck OR a trailer. The trailer is just so damn handy, but I wouldn't want to rely on it for every time I needed to haul something. But I also have motorcycles in the mix, and from time to time they need to be hauled for one reason or the other. I have a nice ramp, and when I bought my dual sport I drove the truck to go get it and that was nice. And I have the luxury of a place to park it in the partially wooded area of our yard, and an ATV that can tow the trailer up the hill to park it. And a huge part of the utility of the trailer is towing it around the yard with the ATV, moving brush and stuff. And the trailer can haul the ATV and then the ATV can haul the trailer around when you get there, and that is sweet. But now at this point I have become RELIANT on the ATV, no way to move the log splitter, etc. And the old one became a PITA and I just upgraded.

And today I realized I just paid about the same for an ATV that I paid for my first new 4x4 truck in 1978...

[BehindBlueI's]

2023 F-150 order guide and price guide, respectively:


https://www.f150gen14.com/forum/atta...ide-pdf.54687/

https://www.f150gen14.com/forum/atta...f1a877a75253a7


I sent a request off to a dealer for a price on a pretty well optioned Tremor and got a few pennies shy of $65,400 pre-tax and pre-rebates:

2023 F-150 Tremor SuperCrew® 4x4 – 5.5' Box 145" W1E
3.5L V6 EcoBoost® with Auto Start-Stop Technology 998
High package 402A
Auto Start-Stop Removal 52X
Front-Axle w/Torsen® Differential 61T
Partitioned lockable fold-flat storage 60P
Twin Panel Moonroof 43V

[BehindBlueI's]

For general shits & giggles I stopped and looked at a certified used '19 GMC Denali AT4, GMC's top line off roader until the Silverado ZR2 and near corporate twin. Soft. No real lockers, just the Eaton that supposedly locks when it detects 100rpm difference between the wheels. That'll be super helpful at trail crawl speeds. The *only* skid plate is the one up front for the radiator. Nice big plastic gas tank hanging low waiting to be ruptured. Exhaust pipe crosses under the transmission pan (pre-heating fluid?) and seems to be the low spot as previous owner had dented it up in two spots. It had been used to tow a camper. Interior was nicer than the pictures indicate, but not up to Ram or Ford standards for similarly priced trim levels, IMO. Cool features were the 6.2L 'MERICAN V8 and a color HUD. The HUD was sweet. I didn't bother to drive it as I was immediately not interested due to how not-actually-offroady the trim was but it was something to cross off the list.

I looked at another Raptor, but it was beat on by the previous owner. He obviously used it as intended, anyone who thinks nobody actually takes them offroad should take a peak under that one. It's seen some things, man, it's seen some things.

[BehindBlueI's]

Info coming out on the 2023 Colorado, including the ZR2:

https://www.thedetroitbureau.com/202...ts-a-makeover/



Interior seems like a step up:



Only motor will be the 2.7L turbo 4 hooked to an 8 speed, power varies by trim level. 310hp / 430 ft-lb for the ZR2. "All 2023 Chevy Colorado models will have the same engine, a 2.7-liter turbo inline-four borrowed from the Chevy Silverado, mated to an eight-speed automatic transmission. The engine has a 30 percent stiffer crankshaft, more rigid cylinder block and fully-forged bottom end." That's down 82hp vs the Ranger Raptor, for those keeping score, but same peak torque. The Ranger gets a 10 speed, as well.

Camera system has 10 views, including underbody: special-edition Desert Boss package, which gets beadlock-capable wheels and other trail gear — even an underbody camera to see how big the rocks are down there! The camera is available on Z71 and ZR2 trucks without the add-on package.

Infotainment seems solid: 11.3" screen standard. Wireless Apple CarPlay and Android Auto are standard, but the infotainment has Google Built-In, which gives the system native Google services.

Same shocks, still front and rear e-lockers. Approach/breakover/departure angles by trim listed here: https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/2...rt-boss-debut/

It looks like a valiant effort. Aesthetically, I'm not sure which I prefer between this and the Ranger Raptor. Raptor wins on drivetrain and customization options (no outfitter switches I can see in the Chevy. I think Chevy's Google based infotainment is probably going to be better than Ford's Sync. Chevy having the underbody camera is pretty cool for rocky trails. No mention of if Chevy is going to have dynamic bending headlights, exhaust modes, and if the intercooler is mounted in a way that makes adding a winch easy.

[bofe954]

Info coming out on the 2023 Colorado, including the ZR2:

Interior seems like a step up:



It looks like a valiant effort. Aesthetically, I'm not sure which I prefer between this and the Ranger Raptor. Raptor wins on drivetrain and customization options (no outfitter switches I can see in the Chevy. I think Chevy's Google based infotainment is probably going to be better than Ford's Sync. Chevy having the underbody camera is pretty cool for rocky trails. No mention of if Chevy is going to have dynamic bending headlights, exhaust modes, and if the intercooler is mounted in a way that makes adding a winch easy.

It finally got push button start...