CCW Live shoot Training Simulator

[oakdalecurtis]

I have owned an indoor live shoot simulator range, contained inside a 45 ft armored box trailer, here in California for several years. You are shooting live rounds out of your handgun at an HD projected scenario with bad guys shooting back at you. We used it to train CCW students mostly. Due to the upcoming restrictive laws passed in Cali, I just recently sold it to the Mariposa Sheriff's Department, and this facility will hopefully help our LEO's in Mariposa be even better trained under pressure. Here's a weblink to a TV news story done about the range if you're curious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n47mpa8Fhg
I can tell you that anyone who has gone through some of the 1200 scenarios available come out truly humbled by the experience, especially if they thought they were a "good shot". The high tech range records the placement of every shot you take and the time you took it, for playback after the scenario unfolds. If you hit a bad guy in a lethal area, he/she drops and the scenario continues seamlessly. If you continue to miss the bad guy, after about 5 seconds under perp fire, the lights go down, scenario ends, and you're "dead". Then we replay the event to show you where you hit, when and why. We always allow the participant to shoot a few rounds at a static bullseye first to show them how it records shot placement and that they are hitting where it says, usually near the bullseye. But when the scenarios unfold and they are being shot at by a bad guy, they typically hit all over the place downrange. We see hard trigger pulldown with low shots, and we see high shots because the shooter sees their front sight and the perp, but they allow their rear sight to drop down slightly, easy to do in the low light conditions. We see hostages get dropped that had run out with hands up yelling "don't shoot", and after the shoot the participant says they "never heard the hostage yell anything". I was getting ready for a run with my .45 auto, and just as the scenario began, my old military magazine with a spot welded bottom plate let go on the welds and all 7 rounds and spring were on the floor! (Murphy' law, I only use newer mags now.)
In the ATM robbery scenario, you watch the armed perp walk across the parking lot after robbing the old lady at the ATM. If you yell at the bad guy, like "Hey, what are you doing!", the perp will turn and and engage you in a gunfight. You can drop him, but if you do, the van he came in has a door slide open and two more bad guys start unloading shotguns at you. No one has gotten both of them and survived the onslaught yet. So you just learned that if you had been quiet and allowed the robber to get in his van and drive away, while you wrote down the license plate, you lived. But if you yell out to the perp and start a gunfight, you died. People constantly told us they "had no idea how difficult it was" to shoot accurately under high stress conditions such as they experienced there.
I wish every CCW owner could experience this type of simulated reality, because it changed how you thought about your carry responsibilities and your situational awareness in a bad event. You carry for you and your loved ones, and after that, you are out on a thin limb. You are not the police. You are not Superman or a Hero. You choose EVERY available option before you reach for your last resort.

[Paul D]

Welcome to PF! Nice sales pitch for your first post. I think a panhandler asking for bus fare would have done a better introduction though.

[oakdalecurtis]

Welcome to PF! Nice sales pitch for your first post. I think a panhandler asking for bus fare would have done a better introduction though.

Actually Paul, as I mentioned, the range is now in LEO hands, so no sales pitch possible. That is why I never discussed the range here while I owned it, only now, otherwise it would have come across as a sales pitch! But you're thinking!

[Lomshek]

One thing I've notice the few times I've shot in a projector simulator like the one you describe is how hard it is to pick up the sights and (usually) notice details.

The shooter has to be in the dark with the light of the screen making it the equivalent of shooting from a dark room into a brightly lit area (very hard to pick up iron sights) and the low resolution of the images on screen makes it difficult to pick up details on the screen.

IDK if that adds to your stats of most folks missing or if that has more to do with the competence of the average gun carrier in general but those are my observations.
(Not at all meant to bash these trainers in general just my experience.)

[oakdalecurtis]

One thing I've notice the few times I've shot in a projector simulator like the one you describe is how hard it is to pick up the sights and (usually) notice details.

The shooter has to be in the dark with the light of the screen making it the equivalent of shooting from a dark room into a brightly lit area (very hard to pick up iron sights) and the low resolution of the images on screen makes it difficult to pick up details on the screen.

IDK if that adds to your stats of most folks missing or if that has more to do with the competence of the average gun carrier in general but those are my observations.
(Not at all meant to bash these trainers in general just my experience.)

You are absolutely correct, the low light makes it difficult with iron sights. I know there are differing opinions on lasers, but in this range, lasers are so good it's almost like cheating. Just put the dot on the perp, trigger, and down they go.

[voodoo_man]

Are you talking about a fats machine?

[Wendell]

Are you talking about a fats machine?

No, the rounds are live, and the gun is your own. It uses a projected image on a paper screen in front of the backstop. A shot timer captures the projected image at the moment of each shot fired (for further review); the hole in the paper reveals where the shot went. As they say: "Your gun, your holster, no excuses."

https://www.sigsaueracademy.com/prod...ement-training

http://www.caps-inc.com/

[voodoo_man]

Interesting.

I've done years on the fats machine and it sucked.

Hopefully this comes to a PD close by.

[BehindBlueI's]

Good for stress inoculation. Scenario given for shotgun backup in a van sounds...far fetched.

[David S.]

Looks like a neat program.