Ammunition: Congress Demands Army and Marine Corps Standardize Rounds

[Jeep]

I am also sure Army wants this settled before a potential SecDef Mattis is in charge....

Bingo. I'd also bet that the people pushing this are political appointees in the Department of Army--the same people who caused the Army to spend billions on "green energy" technologies that do not work.

The Washington political class, and its envoys nested in the Pentagon, aren't going to like a Mattis DOD one bit. The idea that the military exists to be so tough and powerful that we win wars and look so tough in peace that no one wants to go to war with us is going to make beltway brains explode.

[DocGKR]

RevolverRob: As noted previously, aerosolized lead from primers and exposed lead on some bullet bases is indeed a problem—particularly on indoor ranges with poor ventilation and inadequate air flow. Of course the solution is to use lead free primers and reverse jacket projectiles without exposed lead bases, like TMJ, JHP, JSP, OTM, as well as monolithic all copper or gilding metal projectiles such as Tac-XP, TSX, GMX, etc.... If launched using lead free primers, how exactly are lead core, reverse jacketed projectiles supposedly causing lead toxicity to shooters? Folks who exercise due diligence and try to identify even one valid scientific study showing that lead from jacketed projectiles fired into earthen berms percolates through the soil into the water table will be frustrated, as none exist. Better yet, journey to the location of any major battle where massive quantities of lead core or even unjacketed solid lead projectiles were used, like Yorktown, Gettysburg, Verdun, Normandy, etc... and check the subterranean ground water for lead contamination––woops there is none. Go to a major CONUS military facility, like NSWC Crane or Ft. Dix, where literally tons of lead core projectiles have been fired into dirt berms for many decades and check the subterranean ground water for contamination—again, NONE, because lead cores from jacketed projectiles are NOT a problem. Lead is dug out of the earth, molded into bullets, and returned to the earth when shot, where the lead can be dug back up and used again...seems like an ideal recycling plan.

[Jeep]

. . . . Lead is dug out of the earth, molded into bullets, and returned to the earth when shot, where the lead can be dug back up and used again...seems like an ideal recycling plan.

It also sounds like a business opportunity in California. Start a company (call it something like "GreenSolutions"), create a 100 page power point "business plan" for digging up the berms on California government ranges, raise some money from your Silicon Valley neighborhood venture funds, and promise the State of California that you will "remove hazardous lead and other metals from California soil using cutting-edge technology" (bulldozers and screens) in return for a very small government subsidy. (You'll need to make sure that the venture funds that back you have all donated money to the politicians who will be giving you the subsidy).

Most importantly, in a continuing effort to prove and improve the technology, the subsidy will help cover the R&D cost of an essentially unlimited supply of Federal 147 gr. FMJ and HST rounds that you will then fire at targets in front of the berms.

It would be a sacrifice, of course, but anything to make California green!

[spinmove_]

It also sounds like a business opportunity in California. Start a company (call it something like "GreenSolutions"), create a 100 page power point "business plan" for digging up the berms on California government ranges, raise some money from your Silicon Valley neighborhood venture funds, and promise the State of California that you will "remove hazardous lead and other metals from California soil using cutting-edge technology" (bulldozers and screens) in return for a very small government subsidy. (You'll need to make sure that the venture funds that back you have all donated money to the politicians who will be giving you the subsidy).

Most importantly, in a continuing effort to prove and improve the technology, the subsidy will help cover the R&D cost of an essentially unlimited supply of Federal 147 gr. FMJ and HST rounds that you will then fire at targets in front of the berms.

It would be a sacrifice, of course, but anything to make California green!

My God...that would be the single best thing that could possibly get me to move to California for any reason whatsoever. Literally using their own mis-guided ideals and fears to leach off of them and then setup a system where one could shoot off as much ammo as one could possibly comsume...all in the name of science and being "green"! I like it!

[Chuck Haggard]

In my observation of some of the lead free primers, lead free does not mean non-toxic.

I think it was the Swedes that started seeing issues with their issued ammo with lead free primers.

[DocGKR]

As we have discussed, lead free primers offer less reliable ignition, have dramatically shorter shelf life, burn hotter and can cause premature/accelerated wear on firearms leading to a much shorter service life, and we don't have a full understanding of the toxicity of some of the compounds used in them-other than that they are great. Also as noted, the issues with aerosolized lead from primers and exposed lead on some bullet bases is primarily associated with indoor ranges utilizing substandard ventilation and insufficient air flow; not such a problem on typical outdoor ranges as generally used for rifle training.

[Chuck Haggard]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26039682

[Unobtanium]

In my observation of some of the lead free primers, lead free does not mean non-toxic.

I think it was the Swedes that started seeing issues with their issued ammo with lead free primers.

IIRC, it was nausea, vomiting, vertigo. Nothing major...

[SeriousStudent]

IIRC, it was nausea, vomiting, vertigo. Nothing major...

Meh. Eating in a military chow hall already does that.

[jetfire]

Meh. Eating in a military chow hall already does that.

A non-Air Force chow hall maybe.


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