New IDPA Rules

[Zincwarrior]

Wilson sells a lot of flange barreled .45s but I can't shoot one in CDP. Not everything is advertising.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that. However, that doesn't stop me from enjoying the game.

For the slow like myself, will these be effective for the next classification cycle?

[cclaxton]

Send it in.
As one cynic posted, the substantive changes like one second scoring and PCC are likely locked in and you will not change their minds.
But editorial corrections for clarity will, or should be welcome.

I am not convinced that PCC is locked in.There are a lot of other considerations for PCC to be clearly operated that are not in the rulebook. For instance: Defining support or strong hand shooting in PCC (Does that mean support side shoulder or actually using your support hand or what?...I think it should mean support side shoulder, but that is not spelled out.) Can a shooter hold the gun without both hands, using only the grip? I did get an answer back from HQ that a sling would be allowed. But, can a person start with the PCC slung, and in what position? Starting positions are not a big deal...that can be managed. We already do all kinds of stages where you start with the gun out. The purpose of IDPA can easily be modified to add "...and home defense." I am starting to think the PCC thing may be a trial balloon...to see how the membership would take to it.
Cody

[cclaxton]

IDPA M basically means nothing...

That is quite an insult to the many people who have put in thousands of hours of work to make master. There is no perfect system to grade people. There are some short procedures that can be measured to show how fast you are, but in matches with multiple courses of fire, it is rare to find any master shooter who shoots it perfectly. Just ask anyone who won a match if they think it was perfect...they will tell you all the things they need to improve.

Making Master in IDPA does mean a person put in thousands of hours, ammo, mental training, and more to make it....it definitely means SOMETHING. And, many USPSA masters continue to shoot IDPA...why would they bother if it was below them?

If your goal is to try and grade every master shooter, then shoot USPSA or the Bianchi and leave IDPA alone.
Cody

[Peally]

I'm an SSP Master, and I can confirm it was quite easy compared to making A class. You and many others are taking that as an insult, which isn't the point or intention. The point is it's a massive umbrella classification and doesn't tell you a damn thing about how skilled a shooter is other than they made the minimum to get in. Considering the skill gap between me and Vogel, there needs to be something in between there to make it a useful class. Right now all it means is your el pres is somewhere between 8 seconds and 3.5. This is especially critical now that they've potentially made the IDPA classifier even easier with the rule changes.

Look at the current classifications for what they are. You have a whole bunch of them bunched up on the lower end of the skill tree (which is fine), and then nothing for the folks that have trained above that level. If you want to make a parallel to USPSA, IDPA's current class system is D, C, B, SuperGMWorldWinner (if you want to count the DM class, which I don't consider a traditional class since you can't classify into it).

[jlw]

In the grand scheme of things, classifications are just a way to tell someone that they were third among the bottom 10% instead of 52nd.


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[Mitch]

I actually like the scoring changes. I don't really care about PCC or the classifier. This does make me a little more inclined to shoot IDPA. I wish they would budge on AIWB though.


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[Peally]

I wouldn't know, even on a really terrible day at least I'm not in the bottom 10% of a match

In a big match you're already shooting they don't really matter. Pre-match they determine what kind of competition you're going to have (if you're a GM, you want to compete against other GMs obviously). In training they're an excellent indicator of where you stand in the grand scheme of things, (ideally) providing solid goals backed up with a tested classifier system you can try as a benchmarking tool.

[DAB]

i'd hope they give the new classifier a year to shake out, and then if there are "too many" masters, either adjust the cut offs, or create a "grand master", say you have to shoot the classifier in under 40 seconds. i once saw a video of Dave Sevigny shoot the classifier in under 60 seconds.

[cclaxton]

I'm an SSP Master, and I can confirm it was quite easy compared to making A class. You and many others are taking that as an insult, which isn't the point or intention. The point is it's a massive umbrella classification and doesn't tell you a damn thing about how skilled a shooter is other than they made the minimum to get in. Considering the skill gap between me and Vogel, there needs to be something in between there to make it a useful class. Right now all it means is your el pres is somewhere between 8 seconds and 3.5. This is especially critical now that they've potentially made the IDPA classifier even easier with the rule changes.
Look at the current classifications for what they are. You have a whole bunch of them bunched up on the lower end of the skill tree (which is fine), and then nothing for the folks that have trained above that level. If you want to make a parallel to USPSA, IDPA's current class system is D, C, B, SuperGMWorldWinner (if you want to count the DM class, which I don't consider a traditional class since you can't classify into it).

You said IDPA Master means "nothing". IDPA is a sport for the every day concealed carrier to improve their gun handling skills and develop some basic tactics and experience shooting under pressure, sometimes in uncomfortable or unnatural shooting positions and with SHO/WHO and avoiding nonthreats. That is a good thing for our gun carrying community. Competition is a way to add pressure and learn safety and improve guns kills. Most IDPA shooters are not interested in becoming a GM. They are more interested in developing the confidence in their gun handling. Most non-competitive shooters have horrible gun handling skills, and many police officers as well. The more people we get to develop competency in gun handling, the more we will have people on the streets who carry that are safer and better able to handle a situation. I am not saying IDPA is all that is needed to learn good self-defense tactics, but it is better than not doing any. But GM still shoot IDPA, so even they like the unique challenges that IDPA provides that makes it different than USPSA or 3Gun. I shoot all three, and I find value in all of them. We should not, therefore, turn IDPA into just another playground for USPSA Masters and Grand Masters and push the sport into just a different form of USPSA. We should continue to be a sport for the average Joe/Jane and retain the unique concealed carry and home safety character.
Cody

[Mr_White]

This whole discussion is just begging for The Chart!

[img]Skills_zps102fc8f7_03 by OrigamiAK, on Flickr[/img]