How frequently do people impersonate the police in this fashion? It's something I've heard of before but have not experienced myself (obviously).Originally Posted by Paul Sharp
How frequently do people impersonate the police in this fashion? It's something I've heard of before but have not experienced myself (obviously).
I don't know if there is any data maintained on this, I do know I've sat through a number of roll calls over the years where a vehicle and suspect description have been given to BOLO for someone impersonating an officer. A few years ago I had a house in my beat that was a constant source of trouble. I ticketed a vehicle parked facing the wrong way in front of the house. As I was getting the VIN from the front windshield I noticed a set of handcuffs in the cup holder and a MDT stand. The car was an Impala. I moved a little farther towards the driver side door and noticed a light bar control, obviously a homemade version, mounted under the homemade MDT stand. A charger cord was running from the cigarette lighter to the stand so that led me to believe this was some sort of home grown version of a computer stand. That's weird right?
So, we've got handcuffs, a home-brewed light bar control, and MDT stand... in an Impala...
I walk to the front of the car and look in the grill, sure enough. Lights had been installed behind the grill. Red, blue, and white. Maybe the owner is patriotic. Most likely, the owner is a psycho.
Run the plates, comes back with a gang hit. I hold off on hanging the parking ticket, drive up the street and wait for the owner to leave the PITA house so I can stop him. I knock him down a few blocks away from the house. He's wearing an empty paddle holster on his right hip. He tells me he's an "off-duty armed security officer". Big surprise, he's wanted for questioning in a bunch of impersonating an officer incidents. He's a gang member that somehow was also a police explorer in a neighboring town. He copped to pulling traffic stops. Even writing tickets?! He took a deal, it never went to trial.
So that's one I know about. That car definitely looked like an unmarked, if you didn't know any better. There was another one where the offender was making stops on the Kennedy around Chicago. I think that turned out to be a volunteer firefighter. He had lights installed in his pickup so he could respond to fire calls from home? I might have that one mixed up with another one. I know he had some exemption that allowed him to have emergency lights installed in his personal vehicle, which he then used to stop cars.
That probably doesn't answer the question of how frequently however, it's frequent enough that I would have a plan.
Last edited by Paul Sharp; 09-30-2016 at 12:35 PM.
"There is magic in misery. You need to constantly fail. Always bite off more than you can chew, put yourself in situations where you don't succeed then really analyze why you didn't succeed." - Dean Karnazes www.sbgillinois.com
Wow - I had no idea. Thanks for the insight - I will definitely keep this in mind and plan for the future accordingly.
I do know of a doc who has red lights behind the grill of his car, but 1) it's a work vehicle 2) he is a deputy medical director for FDNY and 3) I am pretty sure he has no interest in making "traffic stops."
I'm personally aware of a few incidents. The info that Paul Sharp gave above is right on target, IMO.
An impersonator was hooked up in my county a few days ago when he tried to stop a real auto theft detective. He went so far in outfitting his "cruiser" that he even had a dash camera. The days of impersonators relying on a Kojak light are long gone.
In my first few weeks as a police, I encountered an impersonator. I was driving home late at night after work. I had sped up to catch a yellow light and a pedestrian ran in front of me. When I stopped at the next red light (which shows how much speeding up to catch a yellow helped), a plain brown wrapper of the era pulled in front me, "cutting me off". As a newly minted LEO (who had been a civilian employee in the area where this occurred), this seemed off as did the uniform that somewhat resembled that of the county, park, and state police. I also could not see any gear on the person's waist. The "officer" approached my car and accused me of trying to strike the pedestrian (which it probably looked like I did). After a few seconds of this nonsense, I badged the "officer" and demanded he identify himself. He told me he was "state police". I ordered him to show me his patch which identified him as State Corrections. I then ordered him to turn to show me his nametag. I told him I had never heard of State Corrections officers having traffic enforcement responsibility. He babbled some nonsense about being in a specialized unit trained by the State Police. I drove off, leaving him standing in the roadway, and called the State Police from home.
I received a call from an investigator from the State Police several weeks later. He told me the individual was a probationary officer who had genuinely thought I had attempted to hit the ped. He asked what I wanted done. I told him that the subject had represented himself as a member of the State Police rather than my own and told him disposition of the case was up to him.
The young man moved on in his career and became a County Corrections officer...and was arrested for conspiracy to smuggle drugs and a gun into the jail. While on bond, he robbed a dry cleaning store and murdered the owner, a retired sergeant from the D.C. Metropolitan Police. I wonder if things might have turned out better had State Corrections fired him.
Roy, as to your other question, we project our stops and anticipate motorists stopping in the roadway. I have seen many traffic stops turn into goat ropes when someone decides to pull off the roadway into a parking lot. This often causes major traffic issues for the business and results in cruiser and violator being in hard to manage positions. If it's an empty lot of a breakdown lane and you're right there, go for it (leaving enough room for the cruiser), but generally just pull to the right and stop. Just try to avoid you or the cruiser blocking driveways or side streets.
^^^ Copy that jnc Thanks.
"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." - Thomas Jefferson, Virginia Constitution, Draft 1, 1776
I can think of a few robberies done that way (mostly against dopers by dopers), but no sex crimes. Also note I don't work sex crimes...but that's usually the sort of thing that a department wide BOLO will be issued on.
All I really want you to do is GET THE FUCK OVER PLEASE. It's *incredibly* irritating to be going to something like, oh, say, a child drowning in a retention pond and the car in front of you is either completely oblivious to your lights and sirens or is looking for that perfect spot to pull over "safely" while slowing down to half the speed limit.
My experience with slow rollers is they are usually stuffing dope, guns, looking for a place to run, or trying to get closer to their home boys. Slow rollers not up to no good are generally elderly, asian, drunk, stupid, or some combination. If a lone female was worried and GOT THE FUCK OUT OF THE WAY and I stayed behind her, and then slow rolled to a gas station or something I'd be ok with that. Just don't be surprised if I'm a little keyed up beyond normal when I approach, because I'm fulling expecting guns and dope to go flying out the window any second.
Also, 911 does *NOT* know everyone who's on the road in most jurisdictions (if any). I started out in a very rural county. The local dispatch had radio for two small city PDs, EMS, a host of volunteer firefighters, and the sheriff's department. It did not have radio with state, conservation, excise, etc. This did once cause a real commotion when state was doing a UC raid without bothering to let us know and it got called in as a residential robbery in progress by a neighbor. That doesn't mean you can't call 911, just be aware that just because they don't know who's behind you doesn't mean it's not an actual LEO.
FWIW - When I said "I refuse to answer that question" it's directly in relation to questions that are not related to the matter at hand. A police officer pulls me over for speeding, "Do you know why I stopped you?" My response is usually, "Because I was speeding, officer." "Any particular reason?" "No." "Where are you coming from?" "I decline to answer that question."
See, somewhere between fully admitting that I was committing the crime they stopped me for and answering leading questions that I don't need to answer, I stop answering them. That's just a traffic stop scenario.
In the above, "Got scooped up in a stash house raid and declined to answer questions without an attorney present and therefore spent seven hours at the precinct". It is, of course, contextually dependent. But more often than not, I've learned that shutting your mouth is often the best policy. And I have had scenarios when working in bad neighborhoods in South Dallas, where I've had officers roll on me and ask me what I was doing. The first time, I answered their questions, "Working on a house remodel." And got the third degree, about driving a pick-up truck without a commercial sign on the side and then I was repeatedly asked about the person paying for the remodel and what house it was, etc. I finally decided to stop answering questions and loaded my tools in my truck and drove home. It wasn't worth the hassle. The second time, I got stopped driving a work truck, coming out of a bad neighborhood. The officer stopped me on the pretense of a "suspicious vehicle". I politely declined to answer questions and I was sent on my way, when my DL, CHL, registration, and insurance all came back clear. I know, now, precisely why I was stopped. A work truck, coming out of a predominantly black neighborhood with crack-dealers on every other corner, driven by a white/hispanic guy, wrong place, wrong time. I could have easily gotten flustered and answered questions in a way that resulted in a probable cause search of my vehicle. It would have been wasted time for both of us.
Great thread. I remember that video, and especially the LEO speaking (and confirming what the guy said in part 1). I have assisted local LEOs (I live in a rural area, and am on a first name basis with most deputies, but can't stand the crooked sheriff - but that's another story) on many occasions, so I definitely have no anti-LEO bone in my body. That said, I do agree with the lecturer - there is simply no reason to say anything to the police until your attorney is present. I even take that all the way to traffic stops, "Do you know why I stopped you, sir? - No, officer, I do not." One thing I learned not only from that lecture, but also discussing this with local deputies and FBI SAs and SACs, is to never ever admit any guilt. I even plead 'no contest' instead of 'guilty' on non-moving violations (state parks parking).
Funny thing is, even though everybody tells me that "attitude" will certainly get me a ticket, so far, I only got one non-moving citation (said state park "parking on grass" - mind you one of my rear wheels was maybe 1" on the grass...); every other time I got stopped, I either got a warning, or the officer let me just go. Mind you, even though I don't admit anything, I am respectful, non-confrontational, and upbeat in my interactions with LEOs.
Now, I have not been in a 'justifiable shooting' situation, so that might be a whole different ball of wax. I have read articles about how you need to fully cooperate and spill your beans, via just disclose 'the facts,' to "Officer, I exercise my right to remain silent" and not say one word (until my attorney gets there.) In the current climate the country is in, I am definitely in the latter camp. Not talking to the police is, after all, not an admission of guilt. Although in the court of public opinion, especially with todays pseudo-journalists, whatever you do it'll be a gamble with your livelihood...
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