Alias Training "Divorces"

[orionz06]

Well... I don't know what the man does on a day to day basis... and you typed that shit like I am supposed to know what he is up to every week.

He was just in town teaching a class here that he lost money on. If that and his reputation otherwise isn't enough I'm not sure what to tell ya.


Sent from my Nokia 3310 using an owl

[warpedcamshaft]

I distinctly recall an incident a few years back where Pat Mac issued a refund out of pocket when Alias failed to do so for a student on Lightfighter, as the range was double-booked and the Pat Mac class got cancelled because of it, and the student was unable to get any response from Alias. That being said, this is a lot of classes, so who knows what McNamara will be able to cover.

Acknowledged.

[Josh Runkle]

Well... I don't know what the man does on a day-to-day basis... and you typed that shit like I am supposed to know what he is up to every week.

Do you expect him to work for free for the next six months while paying all of his own expenses?

If anything I would feel bad for PatMac. He didn't cause this. Someone else dicked over you, hundreds of other people, and many instructors. Most of those instructors have long, public histories of being upstanding, quality people, and you're coming off like he's the one that stole your money, rather than a different person.

[warpedcamshaft]

He was just in town teaching a class here that he lost money on. If that and his reputation otherwise isn't enough I'm not sure what to tell ya.


Sent from my Nokia 3310 using an owl

Acknowledged... Thanks.

[warpedcamshaft]

Do you expect him to work for free for the next six months while paying all of his own expenses?

If anything I would feel bad for PatMac. He didn't cause this. Someone else dicked over you, hundreds of other people, and many instructors. Most of those instructors have long, public histories of being upstanding, quality people, and you're coming off like he's the one that stole your money, rather than a different person.

Nope... I never said that. You have ascribed an unsubstantiated motive to a simple question. (And rendered your personal opinion completely useless to me.)

I simply asked if anyone... Let me rephrase that, someone reasonably highly regarded on the forum, would vouch for Pat Mac. His message today seemed to reflect his integrity, but I don't know the man.

[Josh Runkle]

Nope... I never said that. You have ascribed an unsubstantiated motive to a simple question. (And rendered your personal opinion completely useless to me.)

I simply asked if anyone... Let me rephrase that, someone reasonably highly regarded on the forum, would vouch for Pat Mac. His message today seemed to reflect his integrity, but I don't know the man.

Roger that. Sorry, I mistook your questioning of his integrity as if you had an expectation that required reassurance. My apologies.

[jlw]

It'll be interesting to see if anyone can make a fraud or theft by deception case out of this mess. Most likely it'll end up in civil court with a bunch of uncollectible judgements and people in line fighting over assets. The fi fas might get interesting.

[redbone]

Do you expect him to work for free for the next six months while paying all of his own expenses?

If anything I would feel bad for PatMac. He didn't cause this. Someone else dicked over you.

This isn't as clear cut as you make it sound, and its not about 'integrity.'

Imagine this - what if it was PatMac's direct hire business manager that ran off with the pre-paid course fees? Would you expect him to say "sorry dude, you have to pay twice if you want to train with me. Take it up with the missing business manager if you don't like it." I doubt you'd be so sympathetic.

PatMac hired Alias to do work for him, so you could argue he's on the hook for making it right and we shouldn't expect every screwed over student to have to chase down Hotaling (you know, the guy PatMac hired to do work for him). Let him sue Hotaling and try to get the money back.

(Of course, if Alias is a jacked up as everyone is saying, Pat Mac will have a hard time just finding out who pre-paid for his courses. What a mess.)


The trainers incurred the risk by hiring/contracting with Alias. They did it to make their life easier, and maybe they have to take the good with the bad.

But IANAL. Maybe one can weigh in on who might be legally responsible. But I can see an ethics argument arguing that students - who weren't the ones that chose
Alias to handle advertising and booking for the trainers - shouldn't be left holding the bag.

[DocGKR]

"Is SMGLee running things a good or a bad thing?"

Depends. One of my Navy colleagues just reminded me about SMGLee's past faux pas with NSW a few years ago:

"Well he cost you and me, the taxpayers a few thousands of dollars from his pics from inside a NSW armory, that showed various weapons, with their SN's visible. From my understanding, after the Officer running the armory was relieved for cause, all those weapons were pulled and destroyed..."

[Mr Pink]

Get your money back and make a complaint:

Many credit card issuers have policies against sellers charging a credit card account before shipment. If you think a seller charged your account too soon, report it to the credit card issuer. Otherwise, the issuer has no way to know the seller isn’t following its policies.

To dispute the billing error with your credit card issuer, you must:

https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/article...never-received

Make a complaint federal:
https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/#&panel1-1

State/Local:
https://www.usa.gov/state-consumer

There are enough students and instructors to consider taking legal action too.