Heroin Overdose Epidemic - what is your perspective?

[voodoo_man]

I'm still totally confused by the whole narcan thing. On one hand I can see the life saving benefits, but the other wonder if society would just be better off if these junkies would just die already. Maybe we should develop a version of Narcan that has a specific # of doses before it's useless on a person and they die from their stupidity. Let's say 2 doses it works and strike 3 and you're out of the gene pool.

Few things to consider:

Politicians and top brass have to do something and if they are not seen as doing something then they aren't doing something and may be replaced with someone who will do something.

What is that something, well that is largely irrelevant as long as the politicians and brass have something to displaying saying they are doing something.

In this particular case they get to use money from the gov and not actually use local money, which is a win win, while saying they are doing something.

The left really pushes for this type of stuff, and while I do not want anyone to go through the hardship of having a family member, friend or someone their care about die of an overdose, the chances are that they have already come to terms with this and have accepted the fact that this person is an accident and will not be helped in anyway other than succeeding at their constant attempts of suicide.

[Larry Sellers]

The left really pushes for this type of stuff, and while I do not want anyone to go through the hardship of having a family member, friend or someone their care about die of an overdose, the chances are that they have already come to terms with this and have accepted the fact that this person is an accident and will not be helped in anyway other than succeeding at their constant attempts of suicide.

This...we've been handing it out like candy recently and I have dealt with the internal conflict of seeing people passed out with their children in another room or in a car at a stop sign with their foot on the brake and wondered why we do it. As VDM said, the policy makers and folks that sit in community meetings decide what and where we use it. I work in a dump city, there's no money coming in and it's always going out to those in need yet we spend $55 every time we administer narcan. The local shelters have actually begun to hand it out, so I have to wonder if the "first time" we administer it that its actually the 2nd,3rd or 4th time this person has actually been on the receiving end of it.

At the end of the day the guy who signs my checks says we respond to the calls for service and administer narcan several times to the same person in a 30 day period. We go, we deliver the "come back to earth med" and head back to the firehouse. I found that judging people or treating them like shit doesn't do anything but eat at me after the run.

[voodoo_man]

At the end of the day the guy who signs my checks says we respond to the calls for service and administer narcan several times to the same person in a 30 day period. We go, we deliver the "come back to earth med" and head back to the firehouse. I found that judging people or treating them like shit doesn't do anything but eat at me after the run.

Of course I concur, I swore an oath and I will do everything in my power to uphold that oath, especially trying to save people who do not want to save themselves, in some cases more than once.

I just wish the politicians and top brass would invest in preventative measures like education, stiffer sentencing and better narcotics related investigatory training for LE rather than whatever you would call narcan in this current application...

[Larry Sellers]

Of course I concur, I swore an oath and I will do everything in my power to uphold that oath, especially trying to save people who do not want to save themselves, in some cases more than once.

I just wish the politicians and top brass would invest in preventative measures like education, stiffer sentencing and better narcotics related investigatory training for LE rather than whatever you would call narcan in this current application...

Absolutely, I find that the city is more invested in sensitivity training and how to identify hoarding condition classes than how to prevent the issue to begin with. That's another topic for another day.....

[Nephrology]

Absolutely, I find that the city is more invested in sensitivity training and how to identify hoarding condition classes than how to prevent the issue to begin with. That's another topic for another day.....

I just wish the politicians and top brass would invest in preventative measures like education, stiffer sentencing and better narcotics related investigatory training for LE rather than whatever you would call narcan in this current application...

just for additional perspective, making your corner junkies into Lazarus might seem like a wasted effort/lost cause, but this phenomenon is practically part of the healthcare job description. The vast majority of Americans will die because they developed an irreversible, progressively fatal disease (i.e. heart, liver, kidney failure) due to a chronic disease that is often both self inflicted and eminently treatable (obesity leading to high blood pressure, diabetes, etc). $55/dose Narcan is nothing compared to the billions of dollars we spend giving dialysis to people who could have avoided renal failure with simple once-a-day blood pressure medications that cost as little as $5/month. I don't see opioid abuse any differently.

At the end of the day you can lead a horse to water but can never make them drink. It's also important to remember that a lot of people who end up in a trap like this aren't bad people or even necessarily stupid people. Just made some bad choices.

[peterb]

It's also important to remember that a lot of people who end up in a trap like this aren't bad people or even necessarily stupid people. Just made some bad choices.

I recently heard an interview with an addict who talked about walking out of the ED after his third Narcan save and going straight to make a buy so he could shoot up.

When you're in that deep it's not about pleasure -- it's more the fear of how bad you'll feel in few hours if you don't get another fix.

"We'll see if we can get you into a program" doesn't work when there's a clock ticking.

[Larry Sellers]

just for additional perspective, making your corner junkies into Lazarus might seem like a wasted effort/lost cause, but this phenomenon is practically part of the healthcare job description. The vast majority of Americans will die because they developed an irreversible, progressively fatal disease (i.e. heart, liver, kidney failure) due to a chronic disease that is often both self inflicted and eminently treatable (obesity leading to high blood pressure, diabetes, etc). $55/dose Narcan is nothing compared to the billions of dollars we spend giving dialysis to people who could have avoided renal failure with simple once-a-day blood pressure medications that cost as little as $5/month. I don't see opioid abuse any differently.

At the end of the day you can lead a horse to water but can never make them drink. It's also important to remember that a lot of people who end up in a trap like this aren't bad people or even necessarily stupid people. Just made some bad choices.

Agreed..isn't it amazing that in our county one of the leading health issues (obesity) is due to an over abundance of food....one of the top issues in other 3rd world nations? Were eating ourselves to death...I had something for this I swear.......

[Treecop]

And in case heroin and fentanyl didn't get the job done, now there's "grey death"
http://www.wsaz.com/content/news/Pow...421321594.html

Stay safe out there


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[peterb]

https://www.hsdl.org/?view&did=795829

There's a photo in the linked document that shows a lethal dose of carfentanil.

[WobblyPossum]

That's a photo of a lethal dose of Fentanil. Carfentanil is 100 times as strong.


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