.380 defensive ammo

[Chuck Haggard]

I agree. However, since there is no FBI "bone" test....
An intervening arm, for example, might mean that even 12" of penetration is not assured.

I do know of two BUG .380 OISs where the bullets got through the bad guy's arm/s on the way to the torso and ended to fight rather quickly. FMJ ammo used in both cases.

[Sadmin]

And here I sit at times with a .32

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[Velo Dog]

So, does that mean I'm twice as likely to be killed if I carry two .380's .... or half as likely?

:^(

I have some recollection of the F.B.I.'s attempt to score wounding effectiveness in the late eighties or early nineties. Since the .380 was supposedly given a negative "wound value" assessment, the joke at the time was that being shot with a .380 presumably should make one feel better.

[Velo Dog]

If someone puts a couple wimpy .380s in your face you'll stop trying to take their lunch money.

Want to know what fits in my pocket and keeps bullies from taking my lunch money?






My fist

[GAP]

Want to know what fits in my pocket and keeps bullies from taking my lunch money?

My fist

Ya, but, what if I want your lunch money?





(It's funny because I'm a professionally ranked MMA fighter.)

[Velo Dog]

Ya, but, what if I want your lunch money?





(It's funny because I'm a professionally ranked MMA fighter.)

Don't know, but it could get messy. You've apparently never seen me eat!

[BillSWPA]

As I type this, I am sitting in my office with a Glock 26 in my pocket and Kel-Tec P3AT on my ankle. I am wearing a tucked in short sleeve shirt and dress slacks, with no cover garment. As I deal with the beginning stages of arthritis in my knees, I don't want anything any heavier on my ankle. When I ran for fitness, strapping anything to my ankle after pushing one of my kids 5 miles in a jogging stroller was the last thing I wanted to do. A tiny .380 allows me to have a backup gun that otherwise would not be there.

I am self-employed, so I get to do what I want. The above is much more than I would be willing to carry in a non-permissive environment where getting caught could result in several hundred thousand dollars in economic consequences. The tiny .380's have a definite place even as a primary gun. Any time I see someone talking about carrying anything much larger in a true NPE, I know that person has little or no experience carrying in NPE's.

When I help teach my range's NRA Basic Pistol class, I seem to get a disproportionate percentage of older ladies with hand problems. The more I see of them learning how to shoot, the less concerned I am about stopping power, and the more concerned I am with making sure they get something they will actually carry and can shoot accurately. For some of them, a .22 is the best answer.

Even if we are talking about a younger lady with no health issues, concealing a gun is much more difficult for them. 999 out of 1,000 are not going to dress around the gun. They also don't care for much of what we do to hide guns. Again, a tiny .380 (or even .32) has its place. In fact, I may have been more successful at getting my wife to carry much more often than she does if I had been a lot less worried about minimum caliber requirements earlier in our relationship.

Re: stopping power: I have read what DocGKR has written, and do not pretend to be qualified to debate him. I will say that, according to a table linked earlier in this thread, the Winchester JHP in the .380 on my ankle will typically penetrate a little over 9" of gelatin, which will get it to the center of someone with at least a 56 inch chest. That might not be ideal, and there might be good reasons why not, but it is certainly more than "better than nothing."

[David S.]

As I type this, I am sitting in my office with a Glock 26 in my pocket and Kel-Tec P3AT on my ankle. I am wearing a tucked in short sleeve shirt and dress slacks, with no cover garment. As I deal with the beginning stages of arthritis in my knees, I don't want anything any heavier on my ankle. When I ran for fitness, strapping anything to my ankle after pushing one of my kids 5 miles in a jogging stroller was the last thing I wanted to do. A tiny .380 allows me to have a backup gun that otherwise would not be there.

I am self-employed, so I get to do what I want. The above is much more than I would be willing to carry in a non-permissive environment where getting caught could result in several hundred thousand dollars in economic consequences. The tiny .380's have a definite place even as a primary gun. Any time I see someone talking about carrying anything much larger in a true NPE, I know that person has little or no experience carrying in NPE's.

When I help teach my range's NRA Basic Pistol class, I seem to get a disproportionate percentage of older ladies with hand problems. The more I see of them learning how to shoot, the less concerned I am about stopping power, and the more concerned I am with making sure they get something they will actually carry and can shoot accurately. For some of them, a .22 is the best answer.

Even if we are talking about a younger lady with no health issues, concealing a gun is much more difficult for them. 999 out of 1,000 are not going to dress around the gun. They also don't care for much of what we do to hide guns. Again, a tiny .380 (or even .32) has its place. In fact, I may have been more successful at getting my wife to carry much more often than she does if I had been a lot less worried about minimum caliber requirements earlier in our relationship.

Re: stopping power: I have read what DocGKR has written, and do not pretend to be qualified to debate him. I will say that, according to a table linked earlier in this thread, the Winchester JHP in the .380 on my ankle will typically penetrate a little over 9" of gelatin, which will get it to the center of someone with at least a 56 inch chest. That might not be ideal, and there might be good reasons why not, but it is certainly more than "better than nothing."

Because sometimes one like just isn't enough.

[Chuck Haggard]

And here I sit at times with a .32

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It's OK, that's almost a .380

[41magfan]

I have some recollection of the F.B.I.'s attempt to score wounding effectiveness in the late eighties or early nineties. Since the .380 was supposedly given a negative "wound value" assessment, the joke at the time was that being shot with a .380 presumably should make one feel better.

Well, there you go. Perhaps someone should dig up all those mindless derps that have fallen to benign cartridges like the .380 and give them the lowdown?

;^)