ARs for new (panic?) buyers

[rob_s]

As expected, the requests are starting to come in from non-gun-owning friends, family, and coworkers. Predictably, they are asking what AR they should buy. While my temptation is to get on my high horse and say "no AR, you don't even own a Glock 19 yet!", that's probably (a) not helping and (b) more likely to turn them away. The AR has the potential to be the gateway drug to not only the world of guns, but then of shooting, then of training and competing, and then of political beliefs and leanings. So my thinking is that they should be encouraged to buy whatever TYPE of gun they are initially interested in but we should be guiding them towards a gun with the following features:

1) reasonable price. I think that puts most people in the <$1k range, possibly as high as $1.5k.
2) modern features. whether we believe in them or not, folks want (or think they want, or will want almost immediately) things like a mid-length gas system and extended, free-float, handguard.
3) highest possibly quality. I actually put this last instead of first because it probably matters least given the goal of getting a gun into their hands. While I think the 6920 is a better gun than the DPMs with the keylok handguard, they think they know what they want and the 6920 aint it.
4) complete gun. For someone that might be willing to tinker I'd suggest the 6920 OEM and a rail and some furniture. But I don't think most first-time buyers want to, or should, be tinkering.
5) readily available. Obviously the panic that will ensue in the coming weeks will affect this, but I think that most first-time buyers will want to be able to walk into a local gunshop and walk out with a rifle. Wich also rules out the 6920 OEM and similar.

I'm racking my brain, and I can't come up with one. I'm still trying to stear people towards the 6920 complete gun in the absense of anything worth a damn that has a rail on it and retails for ~$1k.

[Chuck Haggard]

S&W Sport for a basic guns, add some MagPul

This one is typically less than $1000 street price;
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/w...layErrorView_Y

[Guinnessman]

Rob,

If I were buying a rifle now, the BCM factory offerings with a rail, or the Daniel Defense rifles would fit the bill nicely for a new shooter. The only problem with these rifles is the fact that they are in the upper end of the price range you mentioned.

The other downside with BCM is their availability at your local dealer. I have seen quite a few Daniel Defense rifles in some of the local shops.

If any of my friends come to me for advice, I will happily walk them thru the process of ordering online and shipping to a local FFL that does transfers for $20. If given the chance to "Lead a Horse to water," my pick would be a factory Colt all day long. The OEM you mention or a simple Magpul edition would be great.

The data points of your "Chart" are still my personal gold standard, and with the affordability of quality AR's today, it's time to buy once, cry once.

[WDW]

I just bought a new blemish BCM complete lower for $320 along with an Aero middy upper w/BCG & charging handle for $359. That's a complete, ready to shoot, top tier gun for a total of $679....hard to beat that

[rob_s]

Most of the shops in my area that I've been in all seem to carry Daniel Defense, oftentimes to a staggering degree when it comes to choosing between models. Because of that, so far my default answer has tended that way with the suggestion to look for a "LW" version. But, those guns are still $1500+, which can be hard for a new buyer to swallow.

I don't bother trying to counsel people through online buying anymore, nor do I volunteer to help with assembly, etc. It just becomes a nightmare in terms of coordinating our schedules, answering "dumb" questions, etc.

[GJM]

I love long guns. In Alaska, I walk around with a long gun in my hands almost daily. Nobody thinks twice about someone walking around with a long gun around here.

Not criticizing the thread, 'cause we always need an AR, but in urban areas, for non LE I see the role of a long gun almost exclusively for home defense, and in a very limited number of situations outside your home. For a non LE person, I just don't see carrying a long gun around in the vehicle as very useful. You have to protect it from being stolen. It is added weight to carry in and out of the hotel room. It may not sit well with LE if you get pulled over. And, in an Orlando type situation, you will almost certainly be fighting with the gear that is on your body.

Not sure about you, but I don't want to be the dark haired male, not in uniform, grabbing my long gun and heading into a shooting situation, as it seems like a good way to identify yourself as a shoot target to an active shooter and law enforcement.

[ASH556]

Rob,
I'm in a lot the same boat as you. Same thing happened after Sandy Hook. Things took off pretty quickly then and within a couple weeks everyone I knew well had unloaded their personal AR for double, triple, or more what it was really worth. The buyers didn't even care what configuration or caliber it was.

It's the old horse to water problem that we face here. Heck, there are long-time employees of the shop where I work as an armorer who STILL come to me with whatever cheap crap flavor of the week rifle they bought on special and want me to "bless" it for them as being good. I used to take the time to check things like gas key screws, castle nut staking, feedramps, etc. At this point, I don't even bother anymore. All they get from me anymore is "yeah man, looks sweet, glad you like it." FACT: it doesn't matter for a couple reasons:
1) they are unlikely to own the rifle longer than a month because they are collectors/traders, not shooters.
2) it won't get shot enough to matter if at all; see # 1.
3) hurting their feelings about their purchase won't help

If it's someone who shows me they're serious about learning, then I will adjust my approach, but for 99% of folks that ask me about AR's, the above is what they get.

[rob_s]

I love long guns. In Alaska, I walk around with a long gun in my hands almost daily. Nobody thinks twice about someone walking around with a long gun around here.

Not criticizing the thread, 'cause we always need an AR, but in urban areas, for non LE I see the role of a long gun almost exclusively for home defense, and in a very limited number of situations outside your home. For a non LE person, I just don't see carrying a long gun around in the vehicle as very useful. You have to protect it from being stolen. It is added weight to carry in and out of the hotel room. It may not sit well with LE if you get pulled over. And, in an Orlando type situation, you will almost certainly be fighting with the gear that is on your body.

Not sure about you, but I don't want to be the dark haired male, not in uniform, grabbing my long gun and heading into a shooting situation, as it seems like a good way to identify yourself as a shoot target to an active shooter and law enforcement.

Mostly irrelevent to the thread, Alaska or no.

This isn't about "need", or "should", but is about the guy that asks what they should buy and what you'd suggest they buy, given the assumption that we're not judging their use case but that we see a benefit to more good people buying more "evil" guns.

[GJM]

Mostly irrelevent to the thread, Alaska or no.

This isn't about "need", or "should", but is about the guy that asks what they should buy and what you'd suggest they buy, given the assumption that we're not judging their use case but that we see a benefit to more good people buying more "evil" guns.

I am OK with all that. Don't take it personally, I was looking for a place to say what I did, about the usefulness of long guns in an Orlando type event, and your thread happened to come along. I guess I should have started a new thread. I use every event like this as an excuse to buy three or four more ARs.

[Mr_White]

The AR has the potential to be the gateway drug to not only the world of guns, but then of shooting, then of training and competing, and then of political beliefs and leanings.

I like this and I agree.