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Thread: Let's talk about transitions

  1. #11
    Member Luke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Les Pepperoni View Post
    ^ This...

    Only thing I'd add is: Once you're getting decent, make sure to mix up transitions drills to work different "modes":

    e.g. shoot target focused close/fast targets and then have to transition to far steel

    -or-

    shoot 7 yard open target, transition to tiny steel, transition to close/fast, then back again.

    You see this in matches ALL THE TIME.
    Been trying to do some close and far stuff in dry fire but Jane t done any in live fire. Not sure why.. But I know what my next live fire session will be working on!
    i used to wannabe

  2. #12
    Member Luke's Avatar
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    Edit: added the Enos quote to Eric's post but not sure how well that ended up. I can't Internet
    Last edited by Luke; 05-25-2016 at 06:00 AM.
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  3. #13
    Member Luke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricM View Post
    I bookmarked this thread when I was researching transitions last year, posts 12 and 13 in particular really helped me understand where the movement should be (and should not be). Still got a long way to go. Recently I've found "point with your hips" to be a useful cue.

    HERE IS THE QUOTE FROM ENOS

    [quote name="benos" post="142261" timestamp="1079735004"]

    It's easy to over think this kind of stuff.
    While shooting a string of fire, the ONLY time your head should ever move is if the upcoming target lies OUTSIDE your peripheral vision. This rarely happens. So, almost always, once your gun has reached your index, nothing above the waist should move as you acquire targets, EXCEPT YOUR EYES.
    Then, without shooting, it's easy to figure out the rest of the mechanics. Stand upright (feet approx in shooting position), looking straight ahead, with arms normally at sides. Then, on cue, as quickly as possible, find and focus on an object on the right edge of your peripheral vision. Repeat many times while becoming sensitive to how your body, from the waist down, naturally responds to the "intent" provided by your vision. It happens to quick to think about. Working in harmony, your feet, knees, legs, and hips rotate together to find the object of desire.

    I often save Word docs of common or good questions; I dug a few up and pasted them in here, so we can get 'em all in one place...
    be

    05.03
    The key to quick transitions lies in SEEING EVERYTHING. Your gun will move quickly to the next target only if you called the shot perfectly on the target you just shot. Think about it. If you "shoot at" a target, but don't know, at the instant the shot fired, if the shot was acceptable, (meaning hit the intended target, whether it was a steel plate or the A box), your mind is functioning in doubt, not certainty. So your gun moves in a half-ass, leisurely manner to the next target. On the other hand, if see the site lift and know instantly and for certain that the shot was acceptable, your eye will locate the next target without hesitation and your pistol will follow decisively.

    01.03
    Transition speed is influenced by two factors:
    1) IMMEDIATE, instantaneous, calling of the shot;
    2) Simultaneous visual acquisition of the next target (either centrally or peripherally).
    When you understand transition speed properly, there's really no "speed" involved. Moving quickly (to the next target) is the result of your INTENTION to shoot the next target as quickly as possible, and is manifested by the occurrence of the previous two conditions.

    10.03
    Disragarding skill in index, two factors determine split times.
    1) How quickly you see the next target.
    2) The precision of your call, on the pervious target.
    Of the two, number two is about twice as important as number one.
    Or, how you leave is more important than where you go.
    Only if you know for certain as the shot is fired that it is acceptable, will you move toward the next target decisively. Hesitation, no matter how slight, always loses.

    12.03
    Perhaps one answer is that, when we snap our eyes to the next target* to lead the gun, we are simply snapping to brown, or to the whole plate. We aren't snapping to the center of the Alpha, or the center of the plate. We are letting our eyes get lazy. Thus, we drive the sights onto a vague area, as opposed to driving the gun to the center of the scoring area.
    That's what most do, and it's a big fat huge loser. Not only will your gun not move decisively to the next target's maximum scoring area, you'll waste time finding it when you both finally commune there.

    We seldom see what we need to see because we're always in a hurry. And if you didn't enjoy hurrying you’d be shooting Bullseye. So as is often true, what's most innate is a source of problems. Because of this, the real challenge is often more akin to interrupting a compulsive response. Looking like this may help unravel a problem without even looking at the specifics of the problem itself. Examine specific scenarios with the filter - In this situation, what do I typically do, and is it the most appropriate or effective response. It's a big topic.

    Calling and transitioning quickly is determined by how you apply your vision.
    Your focus must be flexible and constantly in motion, not stuck on any one thing.
    You must see just enough of what must be seen for you to know that what you want to happen is happening as it is happening. (Holy crap, that sentence is cracking me up.)
    Let go of the speedy transitions idea and experiment with how you find targets.
    Find and see a plate as a clearly recognized round object - before your gun gets there – every single time.
    Find the A box as clearly recognized rectangle (if you can see the scoring lines) - before the gun gets there. (For every target.)
    Even when finding targets as above, keep your vision "soft," so you never lose track of the sights. (That's a tricky one.)
    Learn how you need to see each upcoming target to hit the maximum scoring area as quickly as possible.
    If you can see the A box – then see it. But as soon as you have "bring in the sights." You’ll find they’ll go right to the middle of what you found, if you took the time to find it.
    If the targets is at 50 yards, look right at the dead center of it until your gun breaks into your peripheral vision.
    Think of how the principle of calling extends beyond just the shot.
    Stick with it,
    be
    one more thought:
    Don't get sloppy and just shoot without seeing enough, and be wary of trying to see too much.
    Make it as simple as possible. First you need to clearly locate the target you intend to hit; whether it's a nickel, a playing card, an A box, or an 18 x 24" steel rectangle at 7 yds. Then you need to see enough of the gun to KNOW you are hitting the target as the gun is firing. That's all there is to it.







    [/QUOTE]
    Last edited by Luke; 05-25-2016 at 06:02 AM.
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  4. #14
    Leopard Printer Mr_White's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke View Post
    I think I'm gonna try and hold the same focus I had on my sight and see how that feels. I think a lot of my time is spent re adjusting my eyes as I feel like they focus/refocus slowly.
    I think that actually works really well most of the time, if you can do it.
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  5. #15
    Member Luke's Avatar
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    Gabe and Les, you guys should post some times of known drills that require a big transistion to something with a no shoot on it so we have something to compare times with. How would you even track your progress without knowing other good shooters times? Is there a standard somewhere I haven't seen?

    Or something like transistions you just track your progress compared to yourself?
    Last edited by Luke; 05-25-2016 at 07:54 AM.
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  6. #16
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    Gabe and Les already covered the major stuff about transitions. You mentioned the blake drill in your first post, which is the classic "transition training" drill. Transitions that are the same speed as your splits is in the money, but a major part of that drill is moving the targets farther apart until your transitions start to break down, then figuring out what you need to see to make it work at the new target spacing. Have you tried that?

    Mostly it sounds to me like you are ok at driving the gun to your vision in the target focused range (i.e. 7 yards) but haven't trained your eyes to see the correct sight picture rapidly when it comes to something like an accelerator drill, so that's the area to put in the work.

    Speaking of accelerator drills, that is one of my favorites, and is worth trying if you haven't already.

    Accelerator:

    3 IPSC Metric targets placed at 7, 15, and 25 yards spaced so they are laterally separated by approximately 1 yard in the shooter's vision.

    Procedure: Draw and shoot each target twice, reload, and shoot each twice again.

    Goal time is at or under 6 seconds, accuracy standard is almost all A's with some close C's allowed.

    Lots to learn from the drill. Shoot it different ways, far to near, near to far etc. Each target requires different aiming and trigger (unless you are Gabe?), so it is useful for learning to shift between them quickly. This kind of shift is something you will see in virtually every stage at every match.
    Last edited by Talionis; 05-25-2016 at 09:32 AM. Reason: I r spel guder
    TY83544

  7. #17
    Member Luke's Avatar
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    I'm running a ~5- 5.5second accelerator now. Because the transistion isn't wide. I'm looking to pickup speed on 20ft transistions, something where you are really moving the gun. In the accelerator you barley move the gun. All you do is refine your sights between targets.


    And I've shot it enough to know I always prefer close to far, reload, close to far.


    I haven't tried the Blake drill farther than 10 yards.
    Last edited by Luke; 05-25-2016 at 09:49 AM.
    i used to wannabe

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Luke View Post
    I'm running a ~5- 5.5second accelerator now. Because the transistion isn't wide. I'm looking to pickup speed on 20ft transistions, something where you are really moving the gun. In the accelerator you barley move the gun. All you do is refine your sights between targets.


    And I've shot it enough to know I always prefer close to far, reload, close to far.


    I haven't tried the Blake drill farther than 10 yards.
    Those are way fast Accelerator runs, and if you can regularly pull those off with good hits, I suspect you already know what you need to know about transitions.
    Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.

  9. #19
    Member Luke's Avatar
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    Is that an Enos answer? Lol

    I don't see how the accelerator is a good target transistion drill. And maybe I just am using the word transistion wrong. I just want to know how to effectively go from one target to another that is a good ways away. Obviously you transistion to another target on the accelerator but it's such a small transistion it's like it's not one.

    It's like I loose my gun and go slo mo on stuff that's not stacked together
    i used to wannabe

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Luke View Post
    Is that an Enos answer? Lol

    I don't see how the accelerator is a good target transistion drill. And maybe I just am using the word transistion wrong. I just want to know how to effectively go from one target to another that is a good ways away. Obviously you transistion to another target on the accelerator but it's such a small transistion it's like it's not one.

    It's like I loose my gun and go slo mo on stuff that's not stacked together
    I think of transitions as being horizontal but also in distance like the 7, 15 and 25 of the accelerator. You might also spread the three accelerator targets more to get a challenge in both dimensions. I sure noticed when I spread them more, my times went up.
    Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.

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