Brazilian jiu jitsu or Krav Maga

[BJJ]

In my opinion, BJJ will get you the technique, athleticism, timing, and ability to have a dominant position that will allow to stick your thumb in a guy's eye all day if that floats your boat. Going to Krav Maga class to get told to stick your thumb in a guy's eye won't do the same. I apologize if I misunderstand and I am not trying o be inflammatory. People who train athletic fighting skills can fight as dirty as anybody. All you have to do is throw in all the stuff that is prohibited for competition.

Nyeti, surely you weren't able to stick your finger in people's eyes in a Krav Maga class? Seems like you would go through training. partners very quickly.

Holy f*ck, I hate auto correct.

[Mitch]

In my opinion, BJJ will get you the technique, athleticism, timing, and ability to have a dominant position that will allow to stick your thumb in a guy's eye all day if that floats your boat. Going to Krav Maga class to get told to stick your thumb in a guy's eye won't do the same. I apologize if I misunderstand and I am not trying o be inflammatory. People who train athletic fighting skills can fight as dirty as anybody. All you have to do is throw in all the stuff that is prohibited for competition.

Nyeti, surely you weren't able to stick your finger in people's eyes in a Krav Maga class? Seems like you would go through training. partners very quickly.

Holy f*ck, I hate auto correct.

I agree completely, but there is a different mindset between most BJJ schools and Krav Maga.

I've made the exact same argument, but the one time I had to use BJJ to defend myself I stuck to all those sport BJJ moves and did not do any dirty stuff or even punch the guy who attacked me. I came out on top pretty easily, but all that stuff you hear about reverting back to your training is 100% true in my limited experience.

[BES]

This is something I'm passionate about. I've trained in both in addition to a number of other martial arts so I'll try to give you some good insight. I put a lot of time into Krav Maga before I left it and started training Gracie Barra Jiu Jitsu. I'm going to try and make this as short as possible. Do you want to be able to perform in a fight or altercation or look like you can? That's what it comes down to. You will never get on a mat or in a ring with someone with Krav Maga and go face to face. This is one of the biggest problems with martial arts, too much shyness towards going hands on with someone and actually FIGHTING with an over emphasis on techniques and drills. BJJ is one of the few arts where you're actually going to roll and fight someone, daily. I can't express to you the mental hardness that builds in someone. You're ability to remain calm and manage your adrenaline in a fight and THINK is critical.. BJJ will teach you this on a daily basis as you learn skills and actually roll with someone. Much like shooting the mindset thing is something that a lot of people over look and IMO, from the wisdom of some really great instructors, it is truly one of the most important things. Yes the techniques are important and you will learn many but the ability to think and execute while getting tossed around or choked can't be taught by any drill or form. That being said, BJJ is not the end all be all. If you do it, try to match it with some good standup training and you will become very well rounded. Most good BJJ gyms offer a night of standup/striking training.

[Dagga Boy]

In my opinion, BJJ will get you the technique, athleticism, timing, and ability to have a dominant position that will allow to stick your thumb in a guy's eye all day if that floats your boat. Going to Krav Maga class to get told to stick your thumb in a guy's eye won't do the same. I apologize if I misunderstand and I am not trying o be inflammatory. People who train athletic fighting skills can fight as dirty as anybody. All you have to do is throw in all the stuff that is prohibited for competition.

Nyeti, surely you weren't able to stick your finger in people's eyes in a Krav Maga class? Seems like you would go through training. partners very quickly.

Holy f*ck, I hate auto correct.

Remember my first post.....depends on the instructor. How much BJJ work have you done on asphalt? Best Krav guy I know works a lot on real surfaces and it isn't hitting bags. On the other hand....there is a place for hitting bags. Same thing in BJJ. I worked with the Brazilian instructor who was on the original staff that did the LAPD program. He had a great understanding of LE applications, heavy sport guy, but also was big on rolling ALOT. I got what I was looking for. At the same time a MMA gym right down the street was full of chemically enhanced unemployed early twenties guys who relished injuring cops. Not what I was looking for. Later in life when I was suffering through a ton of injuries and rehab, the Krav gym where you just hit the bag was the right program. Right now there is as much crap in the BJJ world as any other martial arts program. I have heard enough horror stories from various customers, gyms, etc of cycling through instructors because BJJ is currently popular. It is the same as what we have seen with Karste, Kung Fu, Tae Kwon Do, Akido, and certainly with Krav Maga and traditional boxing. Any of these come back to instructor quality more than anything else.

As far as thumbing eyes....the key was at least simulating it as part of a distraction to set or break a hold. What I found was doing some out of the box training, combined with street experience really enhanced what I took away from sport BJJ. Truthfully, what I used to recommend to most folks was BJJ combined with either Muy Thai or Pencak Silat. None of these programs have all the answers. Like many things, solving the problem may take a combination of multiple disciplines to get the solution you want. I have simply taken a lot of things from a lot of places and worked them into a jumble that has worked for me. Most will need to be individualized to each person. Heck, I have changed a lot over the years just due to injury and mass changes in size from concentration camp thin to my current large slow oversize mammal, and what works has changed as well.....with the exception of cutting off blood to the brain, and people don't like things in their eyes.

[Chance]

I came out on top pretty easily, but all that stuff you hear about reverting back to your training is 100% true in my limited experience.

If you won easily, gouging his eyes may not have been an appropriate escalation.

[nycnoob]

Truthfully, what I used to recommend to most folks was BJJ combined with either Muy Thai or Pencak Silat.

Can you say a word our two about what you liked in Silat? Those movements always struck me as very strange.

[EVP]

I've made the exact same argument, but the one time I had to use BJJ to defend myself I stuck to all those sport BJJ moves and did not do any dirty stuff or even punch the guy who attacked me. I came out on top pretty easily, but all that stuff you hear about reverting back to your training is 100% true in my limited experience.

I would say then your encounter was successful and in line for what Bjj is at it roots and core.

Without going into the whole sport vs defensive BJJ(which is a silly idea and notion all together) Good jiu-jitsu is good jiu-jitsu.

I would find a good legit BJJ school with a instructor who's has a solid lineage and a school that supports metro or local law enforcement training. If you have a school in your area that teaches law enforcement orginizations and has a good amount of LEO that train there you can bet your training will be reality based and focused on effective techniques that are honed.

[Mike C]

I'm no expert but I'm going to chime in. BJJ hands down, and not the sport kind. No offense if anyone trains it, there is value in it but the progression in skill/concept development is slower, not always the case but it has been my experience at all the academies and gyms I've seen to include the Baja guys coming in the front door for a, "workout." My recommendation is to find a real Gracie academy that teaches the curriculum base on the 40 lessons Helio Gracie taught. As others have stated it builds the ability to stay calm in suck positions, react appropriately to various types of stimuli and opponents of different sizes, strength, and athleticism. You will also quickly learn the ability to transition from shitty position to dominant position though the use of concepts that are adjustable to your strength and size by teaching timing and the use of leverage and skeletal structure.

Other large benefits I've experienced are that you can actually train against a fully resistant opponent with punches while staying relatively safe without risk of major injury, (instructor and student dependent) which allows you to keep training mitigating down time. There is a myriad of standup work and ground work, all of it is useful and a crap ton of it works into weapons access and defense in preventing others weapon access. I love Brazilian Jui Jitsu it is an awesome system find the right place and instructor and you will quickly reap its benefits. Last bit of advice if you do decide to join a BJJ gym/academy many instructors don't do enough standup work, make sure the place you checkout does standup with gloves at least once a week, more is better and bangs a few times a month once rolling is open to you.

[voodoo_man]

As long as you understand that neither one are the answer to the big question and every aspect of training is just one piece of the pie, BJJ taught from a vetted teacher can produce very competent individual. It is good at getting you to a "fighting" physical condition and understanding what is required to win a confrontation. There are plenty of pitfalls and issues with any such "art" and that revolves around lack of rep completion, competition based win criteria and lack of weapon handling.

If you plan on supplementing your overall training with BJJ primarily I would caution you as real world confrontations do not work like that.

[Dagga Boy]

As long as you understand that neither one are the answer to the big question and every aspect of training is just one piece of the pie, BJJ taught from a vetted teacher can produce very competent individual. It is good at getting you to a "fighting" physical condition and understanding what is required to win a confrontation. There are plenty of pitfalls and issues with any such "art" and that revolves around lack of rep completion, competition based win criteria and lack of weapon handling.

If you plan on supplementing your overall training with BJJ primarily I would caution you as real world confrontations do not work like that.

What he said.