Travis Haley Negligent Discharge

[Dagga Boy]

I called mine in and ratted myself out. I found out a long time ago that the best thing you can do to disarm negative events is say "I f&cked up". Many of you would be shocked that I actually have part of my personality psych profile that I hate to be wrong.....shocking, I know. My way to deal with something that I know is in my DNA is to own the mistakes when I do make them to counter how hard I will defend a position when I really think I am right. One of the biggest issues we have in society is an inability to own mistakes.....and we have all made mistakes. Honestly, had Travis said "we should include the scene in a bloopers real or as an example why the four rules are so important....because if you try not to violate any, there are fail safes so that nobody gets hurt for that failure. Know what.....it would have been over before it started. Likely a bit of ribbing.....which is always going to happen, and anyone who has served in any kind of team environment should be immune to, but he would have actually earned a ton of respect from many.

Oh yeah.....the advice I got on "owning" mistakes came from a few mentors who are true examples of genuine "warriors". Also, if you can't own mistakes, how the hell can you ever have a good hot wash of events and operations, which is how REAL advances are made in the training and tactics world.

[GJM]

Most people think that admitting a mistake is a sign of weakness. The smart people have figured out that admitting a mistake can be a sign of strength.

This adversion to admitting a mistake isn't just a shooting thing. The stats show upwards of 80 percent of aircraft crashes are due to pilot error, yet it is unusual to hear a pilot say they made the mistake. It is always some lame excuse and/or someone else's fault.

I still remember the ND I had twenty years ago. I called my wife and immediately fessed up, although that may have been influenced by the .45 caliber hole in our basement door, and the spokes on three of her Yeti racing bikes I damaged.

[StraitR]

Most people think that admitting a mistake is a sign of weakness. The smart people have figured out that admitting a mistake can be a sign of strength.

This adversion to admitting a mistake isn't just a shooting thing. The stats show upwards of 80 percent of aircraft crashes are due to pilot error, yet it is unusual to hear a pilot say they made the mistake. It is always some lame excuse and/or someone else's fault.

I still remember the ND I had twenty years ago. I called my wife and immediately fessed up, although that may have been influenced by the .45 caliber hole in our basement door, and the spokes on three of her Yeti racing bikes I damaged.

BS, you would have owned it straight away, door and bike wheels be damned. You regularly say what you mean, and mean what you say, regardless if it's contrary to the popular opinion or not. It's a redeeming quality not found in those that require the approval of others.

[RevolverRob]

I don't trust a soul who says, "I'm always safe with a gun."

I've had one ND - I was setting the safety on a Remington 700 on the rifle range and I put my finger inside the trigger guard and touched a round of .243 off, very inadvertently, by pressing that 2-pound trigger. I was fortunate that the gun was on the bench, pointed down range, and the range was hot.

I've had one AD - A mechanical failure in an inexpensive blow-back .22 pistol that I got from an uncle. The firing pin got stuck forward, because the firing pin spring jammed on a manufacturing defect (burr in the firing pin channel). I loaded a magazine and launched the slide forward...only to my surprise to have a slam-fire. Again, I was fortunate I had the gun aimed down range, it was a .22, so I was able to control it, without any issues. That gun was promptly disassembled and inspected. When I found the burr in the channel, I decided it was safest to destroy the gun (it was an "Saturday Night Special" Erma that you couldn't get parts for or service, anymore).

My point is - mistakes can happen and mistakes can be genuinely accidental or negligent. But you have to acknowledge them and learn from them.

At this point - Haley actually needs to acknowledge the mistake and the handling of it. It's a dumb thing to not do it.

-Rob

[GardoneVT]

I don't trust a soul who says, "I'm always safe with a gun."

I've had one ND - I was setting the safety on a Remington 700 on the rifle range and I put my finger inside the trigger guard and touched a round of .243 off, very inadvertently, by pressing that 2-pound trigger. I was fortunate that the gun was on the bench, pointed down range, and the range was hot.

I've had one AD - A mechanical failure in an inexpensive blow-back .22 pistol that I got from an uncle. The firing pin got stuck forward, because the firing pin spring jammed on a manufacturing defect (burr in the firing pin channel). I loaded a magazine and launched the slide forward...only to my surprise to have a slam-fire. Again, I was fortunate I had the gun aimed down range, it was a .22, so I was able to control it, without any issues. That gun was promptly disassembled and inspected. When I found the burr in the channel, I decided it was safest to destroy the gun (it was an "Saturday Night Special" Erma that you couldn't get parts for or service, anymore).

My point is - mistakes can happen and mistakes can be genuinely accidental or negligent. But you have to acknowledge them and learn from them.

At this point - Haley actually needs to acknowledge the mistake and the handling of it. It's a dumb thing to not do it.

-Rob

Looking at it from a business perspective, I can understand why he'd duck this. His customer base wouldn't care ; Haley could go into a big speech about responsibility and safety , and it would sound like Charlie Browns "womp womp wah womp".

When ethics is lost among the customers, the merchants won't be far behind.

[BehindBlueI's]

This adversion to admitting a mistake isn't just a shooting thing. The stats show upwards of 80 percent of aircraft crashes are due to pilot error, yet it is unusual to hear a pilot say they made the mistake. It is always some lame excuse and/or someone else's fault.

In today's society, fear of liability drives a lot of what "we" do, whoever "we" are. Admitting the mistake comes back to bite you in civil court, the malpractice suit, whatever.

[SLG]

In today's society, fear of liability drives a lot of what "we" do, whoever "we" are. Admitting the mistake comes back to bite you in civil court, the malpractice suit, whatever.

And if that's not a sad commentary on the state of our society today...

No wonder we are circling the bowl.

[GJM]

In today's society, fear of liability drives a lot of what "we" do, whoever "we" are. Admitting the mistake comes back to bite you in civil court, the malpractice suit, whatever.

I can assure you, it is not fear of liability that motivates pilots to not fess up. It is fear of looking stupid. Further, the NTSB will make an official determination of the cause of an accident, regardless of what the pilot says.

In the case of Haley, it also seems unlikely that his behavior was motivated by fear of liability. And, to my point, Haley may have thought fessing up to the ND, would may him look bad. As it turned out, the ND was irrelevant, but his failure to acknowledge the mistake was relevant, and will likely follow him for years.

[Dagga Boy]

A lot of what I do on a range these days in regards to safety have come from the time I spent in aviation. I worked with some stone cold pro's, learned from some of the best, and was sent to some great schools and classes. Things like risk mitigation, multiple layers of checks, and not trusting humans, especially when humans are operating dangerous equipment in high stress situations and crisis. Also.....keeping things simple when they do not need to be complicated, and forming good consistent habits.

[Wendell]

Most people think that admitting a mistake is a sign of weakness. The smart people have figured out that admitting a mistake can be a sign of strength...

I consider it a sign of good character.

TSA Story!
by John Farnam | 12 Feb 2014 | 2014 |
http://defense-training.com/2014/tsa-story/