OMG... I wanted to claw my fucking eyes out...Originally Posted by Peally
OMG... I wanted to claw my fucking eyes out...
I didn't want to get into another poo fling fest with someone who was a fan of his but yes your assessment was similar to mine
Semper Gumby, Always Flexible
Not saying I'm a fan...just interested in the theory...which is why I asked about relevant times for the drill when I posted. Most of what you find about this drill is competition related using varying degrees of competition gear. I have yet to find a recent video using a level 3 holster and mag pouches with flaps...which will slow the drill for most people.
Most cops don't shoot competitions and haven't earned a Classification in an action sport as I have in the past. They abhor going to the range and would be perfectly happy going once per year to qualify and that be the end of it. Yes, it is a drill...and I will use it as a measuring stick to some degree. That's about it as far as I'm concerned with it.
If you really want to slowpitch softball it, just do Travis Haley's neutered version.
https://youtu.be/c1CI4sL_EiI
Beware, Haleybonics ahead.
Totally get it and I think what Peally and I are saying is more in line with that you're saying. I.e. "Just do this drill, from here, shooting those targets."
It is just a drill. Just a benchmark. Don't over complicate it if you don't need to.
I understand why some may use it a as a test and do odd loading in their magazines, however, that isn't repeatable, measurable performance that kicks your dudes in the ass to get gooder with the retention gear.
7 Seconds from a retention holster and retention carriers with solid hits is a really solid run, really, and that is doable - In the video, so much time was burned going back to the right-most target, then needing to round dump a round and then go back to the other targets...
KH is amazing and foundational in "American Pistol Craft". No disrespect to him.I didn't want to get into another poo fling fest with someone who was a fan of his but yes your assessment was similar to mine
However, the video is really kind of like making apples-to-orange comparisons. Is it a scenario? A Test? A drill?
What's the difference?
Drills are repeatable and measurable.
Scenarios may or may not be repeatable and may indicate mental resilience, processing, etc. Perhaps, in that case - chuck the timer out and focus on the qualitative aspects of shooting.
Maybe we've oversimplified El Presidente, however, it is undeniable that the current, USPSA-based, incarnation is a benchmark/drill that is the "juice" for a lotta dudes to get better and is a remarkable benchmark testing ALL aspects of performance shooting:
Draw, reload, splits, transitions.
If I meet a guy who says they run 4 & 1/2, that means something to me. Like guys boasting about their quarter-mile times...
As a guy who's trying to slowly claw his way out of C and into B in Production, I'd be quite pleased if I could consistently do 8 second and under runs at El Pres; that would mean that as long as I was getting good hits (say 8A, 4C or better), I'd be at 6.5-7.5 HF, which is > 60%. Of course, it'd be really nice to be 56 points or better in under 7 seconds (A class), but I'm not there yet. Trying to honestly self-evaluate, the low-hanging fruit for me is probably in the draw (mine is definitely too slow), and consistency at speed while reloading. Sometimes everything "clicks" and the mag magically goes into the gun quickly, other times, not so much. I need to go back to making regular dry fire a thing that I do.
A 7 second run with 2 C in production is a 56 point run. That's 56/7 = 8HF, which is 77%. Solid A class run.As a guy who's trying to slowly claw his way out of C and into B in Production, I'd be quite pleased if I could consistently do 8 second and under runs at El Pres; that would mean that as long as I was getting good hits (say 8A, 4C or better), I'd be at 6.5-7.5 HF, which is > 60%. Of course, it'd be really nice to be 56 points or better in under 7 seconds (A class), but I'm not there yet. Trying to honestly self-evaluate, the low-hanging fruit for me is probably in the draw (mine is definitely too slow), and consistency at speed while reloading. Sometimes everything "clicks" and the mag magically goes into the gun quickly, other times, not so much. I need to go back to making regular dry fire a thing that I do.
If you shot .25's on splits and .4's on transitions thats: 3.1s.
7 - 3.1 = 3.95 seconds to get a draw and reload done, or 1.95 per draw and reload.
Now you tell me: Is 1.95 to draw-to-shot a glacial pace?
Indeed. I am still around 10 seconds all in.As a guy who's trying to slowly claw his way out of C and into B in Production, I'd be quite pleased if I could consistently do 8 second and under runs at El Pres; that would mean that as long as I was getting good hits (say 8A, 4C or better), I'd be at 6.5-7.5 HF, which is > 60%. Of course, it'd be really nice to be 56 points or better in under 7 seconds (A class), but I'm not there yet. Trying to honestly self-evaluate, the low-hanging fruit for me is probably in the draw (mine is definitely too slow), and consistency at speed while reloading. Sometimes everything "clicks" and the mag magically goes into the gun quickly, other times, not so much. I need to go back to making regular dry fire a thing that I do.
I think that just shows how easy scoring highly on the USPSA El Pres is
Semper Gumby, Always Flexible
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