Scenario: Youre in the Wilderness . . .

[SamAdams]

In the past that was certainly true; I dunno about nowadays. The local PD just sent several dozen (with more being prepped for shipment as they get them off the street) relatively new Gen4 G17s back to Smyrna to be refinished. These pistols were issued earlier this year, and rusted almost immediately; badly.

Supposedly, Glock isn't doing the Tenifer thing anymore; either here, or in Austria. I've heard it several ways; an appeasement to the enviro-nazis, or due to new government regs… the Tenifer process apparently creates some pretty heinous ethyl-methyl bad shit as a by-product. Dunno for sure exactly what the deal is, but I've seen a few of the pistols; they were BAD.

I know our FTU guys are keeping a close eye on the 1000+ new Gen4 17s and 22s we just issued.

.

This could put a different spin on this scenario question. I have Glocks with the old finish and the new Gen 4 type finish. I had heard that while the newer finish might easier/quicker show holster wear compared to the old (which I don't care about) - it still protected the base metal from corrosion. Thanks for posting on this. Please let us know how the situation developes with the PD and LSP pistols.

[SamAdams]

Whatever did the doughboys in the trenches of WWI do with their M1911s and M1917s?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UT9N8gw5Ch0

I wonder what kinda 1911 he was using ?

[LSP972]

This could put a different spin on this scenario question. I have Glocks with the old finish and the new Gen 4 type finish. I had heard that while the newer finish might easier/quicker show holster wear compared to the old (which I don't care about) - it still protected the base metal from corrosion. Thanks for posting on this. Please let us know how the situation developes with the PD and LSP pistols.

I spoke with one of their (PD) armorers this morning. The count is now up to 70+ pistols going back to Glock.

A bit later in the morning, we were out at our range doing some trajectory comparisons, and I ran across some SWAT buds; there are still a few left in First Platoon that are from my days there.

They were the first LSP troopers to get the Gen4 pistols; they've had them for close to a year now. They have seen some isolated rusting, but nothing like BRPD. I suspect that has a lot to do with how their iron is maintained. Now that rank and file troopers (who can be just as slothful as your average city cop or deputy sheriff) have the guns, we'll see what shakes out.

.

[Jim Watson]

Jeff Cooper once wrote kind of a Dear Abby for Shooters column in Guns & Ammo back when it was more than a collection of new product press releases.
To the guy going down a desolate river, he recommended a 1911 and "half a pound of spare parts."
That was before we had Glocks, but the principle applies. The military weapon is rugged and intended for easy maintenance and repair when necessary.

[LSP552]

I spoke with one of their (PD) armorers this morning. The count is now up to 70+ pistols going back to Glock.

A bit later in the morning, we were out at our range doing some trajectory comparisons, and I ran across some SWAT buds; there are still a few left in First Platoon that are from my days there.

They were the first LSP troopers to get the Gen4 pistols; they've had them for close to a year now. They have seen some isolated rusting, but nothing like BRPD. I suspect that has a lot to do with how their iron is maintained. Now that rank and file troopers (who can be just as slothful as your average city cop or deputy sheriff) have the guns, we'll see what shakes out.

.

I wonder if BRPD just got a batch with poor finish instead of a global mass fail?

[Chuck Haggard]

Page 48, towards the bottom of the page;
http://americanhandgunner.com/1979issues/HSO79.pdf

Stolen from another forum;

Jeff's account of his kayak expedition down the Rio Balsas in 1962 is what you're referring to. It's in his book "Another Country".

Short story is, Jeff and companions kayaked down that remote Mexican river. Jeff's old 38 Super autoloader (.45 was a banned cartridge in Mexico) was on his hip. His companion for the trip was Dr. Barney Goodwin of Big Bear, CA, who carried a 38-44 Outdoorsman revolver by S&W. Jeff's account is that they were completely submerged at least every other day. Every evening, Jeff checked both sidearms for function. Usually Barney's revolver had to be cleaned of silt and bits of junk, and completely disassembled almost every time in order to restore function- Jeff's 38 Super "could be pretty well counted on to simply drip dry". He fired 74 shots on that expedition and never had a malfunction.

Jeff points to this as "one of the distinct advantages of a well-made self-loading pistol over a revolver".

I forgot Cooper's 1911 for that trip was a .38Super, but being reminded makes me think of this ad;

[LSP972]

I wonder if BRPD just got a batch with poor finish instead of a global mass fail?

Dunno. Could be. Whatever the reason, they've got a real problem with it.

Most of the po-lice guns coming into the lab these days are Gen4 Glocks. While I haven't noticed any felony corrosion issues, I am seeing some corrosion here and there, where we used to see NONE. So I know it has become an issue with Glocks.

Just how bad of an issue, remains to be seen...

.

[JonInWA]

Whatever did the doughboys in the trenches of WWI do with their M1911s and M1917s?

They had a well developed sense of self preservation combined with an effective NCO structure reinforcing proper periodic and/or situational weapons cleaning and lubing protocols. When you were in a trench, one's pistol could easily be a primary weapon in trench raids-both in carrying them out and in protecting one's self from...So if you wanted to live you took care of your stuff. It was a significant motivator.

While the preponderance of my Glocks are tenifer-ized Gen 3s, I still subject them to regular cleaning and lubing, both after use and periodically. To paraphrase LAV, if you treat your firearms like a lawnmower, a Glock is a good tool that'll perform with considerable neglect, but for something I'm potentially depending my life upon, a modicum of cleaning/lubing is very easily accomplished with a Glock-why have a rusty lawnmower?

Best, Jon

[JonInWA]

1911's dont require any tools to take down. I think the rim of a cartridge will remove the grip screws, everything else takes down pretty easily.

I havent done it with the tool in question, but I think I could take a Smith revolver down with my swiss army knife or one of the flat keychain or pocket screwdrivers.

While I might take a 1911 out in the bush (with the caveat that would be a far second choice to a my Glock 21 for wilderness use), there's no way I'd take ANY Smith & Wesson revolver into the bush, given the option of an easily field-strippable Ruger GP100 or Security/Service/Speed Six (preferably in stainless steel). Smith-vs-Ruger durability discussions aside, I simply feel that a Ruger is a more wilderness-friendly option vis-a-vis the discussion points raised in this thread.

Best, Jon

[GJM]

I wore a 329 .44 magnum daily for five or more years through the warmer months in Alaska. So did my wife.

Waded in rivers with them, out in all sorts of adverse conditions, did minimal maintenance beyond wiping with a rag, and they never missed a beat.