Index vs press out

[Mr_White]

Max Michel draw video:

He breaks down the steps differently than I do, but I'm on board with the final overall draw. I tried pausing at different points to look at specific details and I am reminded of something I don't like about practicing at an artificially slow speed - he changes the technique. When he does a half speed draw demo he is joining his hands much later than when he does at full speed. I agree with givo08: looks pretty much like SLG's draw to me, at least in terms of draw path.

I would not personally call MM's draw a press out. The sights are only in the true eye-target line at the very end of the stroke. Again same as SLG's draw appears and mine as well. Before that he can be aiming with index/kinesthetic feel, and coarse visual reference. He refers to acquiring his sights as he extends the gun, but that is not going to be seeing a sight picture per se, it is going to be using coarser visual and kinesthetic alignment, and seeing the sights rise toward the eye-target line at the end of the stroke. At the end he can then get an actual sight picture. He is definitely also saying to draw at full speed, then clean up sights at the end. He seems to be only placing his finger into the trigger guard while extending the gun and doing all the active pressing at the end, which is another non-press out element. That does also beg the question of whether a press out, in terms of active trigger manipulation while the gun is extended, can really apply to a very short and light trigger like on the 1911 MM is shooting.

StraitR, you can post the Draw Comparison video if you want, no sweat. I think I already posted it earlier in the thread so I'll feel like a dick if I post it again, but you can if you think it would further the discussion.

[Mr_White]

I hope that you guys get what I am thinking about and would love to hear your thoughts on keeping the stroke from a two handed grip similar with both the draw and the reload.

I don't really think it's that big a deal either way. It's nice in and of itself to have commonality and one less technique, but the specific efficiencies of different techniques can also be nice - it requires practicing another thing. A lot of people carrying AIWB make that choice already. The most efficient draw from AIWB doesn't have a #2 position, it just goes 1-3-4. The 2 is a detour and a separate path for the gun, when the decision is made to draw to retention/the 2. Or the AIWB draw can be done to incorporate the 2, but then it will be considerably less efficient every time the draw is done to full extension and the 2 wasn't specifically needed.

I think I am close to doing what you are saying even though I wouldn't get too excited about having differing paths to the target from the draw vs. a reload, as long as they both get practiced. I reload a little lower than a lot of workspace people, more like sternum height, and that is pretty close to where I join my hands in the draw.

[Surf]

Agreed on the Max Michel video. His demo draw is different than his full speed draw. I also break it down and explain it a bit different but the end result is indeed similar.

[JCS]

Bumping this thread. After reading the video equipment thread and Surf's posts on indexing and npa I found this.

Great stuff.


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[SsevenN]

Snip

That was an excellent visual aid to support your explanation, you've managed to articulate draw-stroke nuances I have "felt" in my shooting but have been unable to personally observe or quantify.

[todd]

My .02 cents, either works and as with everything has plus and minus. The "index" is the quickest, by far. The "press-out" will work no matter where or what is in front of you (steering wheel/table). The main thing to do is practice it correctly. I favor the press out for the obstacle and quicker sight alignment. I see way to many people doing the index, and just coming up, they fail to realize it take practice and about half way you slow down, the key is that when you come to rest your pistol and sights are on target. I have done some drill's with a lot of students (non competitors-different area), the index is quicker to get pistol up, but the press out is quicker and more accurate for the breaking of the shot. In my mind set what matters to me is the KISS principal that will work in anything, and can get effective shots on threat as needed.