Secretary of Navy ignores Marine Corps study on gender-integrated infantry

[LittleLebowski]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...infantry-unit/

Mabus questioned the findings of the research after a four-page summary of the results was released Thursday, saying he still thinks all jobs in the Marine Corps should be opened to women. He said results that found women were more than twice as likely to be injured and ultimately compromise a unit’s combat effectiveness were an “extrapolation based on injury rates, and I’m not sure that’s right,” he told NPR.

Once, long ago, a tyrannical majority captured the government. They said they would make all individuals equal. They meant they would not let any individual be better than another at doing anything. Excellence was to be suppressed or concealed. The tyrants made their government act at great speed 'in the name of the people.' They removed delays and red tape wherever found. There was little deliberation. Unaware that they acted out of an unconscious compulsion to prevent all change, the tyrants tried to enforce a gray sameness upon the population.

[JHC]

The Congress can impeach the Secretary of the Navy can't they? I might expect something like that from Congressman Duncan Hunter and he'd better step lively about it.

Mabus is unbelievable.

[Alpha Sierra]

This will last up until the first American military woman is raped and beheaded on video

[GardoneVT]

This will last up until the first American military woman is raped and beheaded on video

Females have been captured by enemy personell, err "combatants" before.

The biggest danger IMO isn't combat related activities. It's the social damage one or two women in a company of twenty horny dudes can cause. The Air Force has the highest number of women in the ranks, and you'd think that's a good thing. It isn't under the current system of "assign women with the boys" , unless you're a fan of pointless unit drama and severe morale issues.

When an all male or all female unit gets down to business, that is exactly what happens. But toss one girl into an all guy group -because we won't get a 50/50 mix of women in the military without a draft- and you get half the dudes trying to bang her while she develops a crush on , say,the unit commander who's probably married. Toss in good ol' Article 134, and we've ensured the folks in Hollywood wont want for saucy screenplays.

Male unit leadership likely wont discipline the female(s) if she screws up because politics and the appearance of harassment , so now you've got discipline standards fail on top of the hormones.

From an intellectual standpoint I fully support women in combat and military service. If a group in society exercises the right to select and run the government, that same group needs skin in the game should said government they helped pick decide to go to war. But women ,until our social customs and biology catch up to that lofty goal, need to serve in their own units with direct female leadership and supervision.

No mixing men and women in permanent assignments . As anyone whose ever dated a crazy woman -or worked a DV case -knows firsthand, females are more then capable of serious violence when called upon.

[Alpha Sierra]

Females have been captured by enemy personell, err "combatants" before.

I know that

I didn't think I had to explain my point, but I shall anyway: wait until an American servicewoman gets raped and brutally executed on video. It's just a matter of time. THEN, watch the policy change.

As for your other comments, 100% concurrence. I am SO glad I EOADS right before women started to be assigned to combatant ships. I wanted NO part of that discipline shitshow.

[Kevin B.]

http://warontherocks.com/2015/09/wha...infantry-unit/

[TCinVA]

I know that

I didn't think I had to explain my point, but I shall anyway: wait until an American servicewoman gets raped and brutally executed on video. It's just a matter of time. THEN, watch the policy change.

If the people pushing this stuff don't really care about women getting damaged and broken, do you think video of one being brutally executed by some booger-eating savage would push them off their agenda? If people are busying themselves willing into reality things they know to be false because it's a requirement to be seen as a "good" person in today's age, would listening to a woman's horrible scream through a slit throat or seeing her charred corpse being drug through the streets really make much of a difference? Would such things make it past the media filters that many/most people willingly adopt?

I wish I shared your optimism. I don't see much of a willingness to acknowledge the costs of feel good policies. I don't believe that these things are unknown or unknowable...in my view they're actively suppressed and ignored which is why we have some of the problems we have in western civilization today.

I don't think your proposed scenario is going to change that. I hope it never comes to pass in the first place, and if it does come to pass I hope we have the fortitude to learn from it...but I'm not optimistic.

[Jeep]

The biggest danger IMO isn't combat related activities. It's the social damage one or two women in a company of twenty horny dudes can cause. The Air Force has the highest number of women in the ranks, and you'd think that's a good thing. It isn't under the current system of "assign women with the boys" , unless you're a fan of pointless unit drama and severe morale issues.

When an all male or all female unit gets down to business, that is exactly what happens. But toss one girl into an all guy group -because we won't get a 50/50 mix of women in the military without a draft- and you get half the dudes trying to bang her while she develops a crush on , say,the unit commander who's probably married. Toss in good ol' Article 134, and we've ensured the folks in Hollywood wont want for saucy screenplays.

If America was governed by adults, and if adults elected our leadership, then the fact that boy/girl games will always go on in a military unit filled with 18-25 year old men and women would be obvious.

Sadly, the American electorate is increasingly not made up of adults but of children inhabiting adult bodies--children who still believe that if you close your eyes and wish things were different it will happen. And the people who are elected by those voters are the types who promise Utopia in which the evils of gender roles can be wiped out by government diktat and military discipline.

It won't happen because it can't happen. Men and women always will be attracted to each other, and especially those who are in the 18-25 category. Even the best and most disciplined will develop crushes on soldiers/sailors of the opposite sex no matter how hard they try not to.

We have been experimenting with mixed sex units for over 40 years now, the results are always the same and they will continue to be the same no matter how many rules we pass because no amount of rules can overcome human ontology.

Putting aside the fact--and it is a fact--that the vast majority of women are not built for combat, neither men nor women are psychologically built to be integrated into mixed-sex units, and especially combat units. Only ideological lunacy--something to which many politicians, especially in this administration, are enslaved--supports continuing on this course.

[LittleLebowski]

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/stor...ment/71632666/

Before opting out of the task force, Sheffield, 23, had decided the infantry wasn't for her.

"It sucked; it really sucked," she said. "I wouldn't do this experiment again."

Within the integrated rifle platoons, Sheffield and other volunteers said unit cohesion became quite strong. In dirty and charmless field conditions, male and female Marines got serious about the tasks at hand and developed close sibling-like relationships, they said. But Sheffield said most of her female colleagues in the unit agreed with her by the time the assessment was done. It wasn't for them, she said.

"Over time, your body breaks down," Sheffield said. "Our backs were hurting. Out of 100 female Marines, I'm going to say a good 20 could do this."

[TCinVA]

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/stor...ment/71632666/

I appreciate her honesty.

Infantry service breaks people. I don't know very many guys who did it for more than one tour who didn't leave with some sort of injury or damage that plagues them for the rest of their life...and that includes guys who were in when there wasn't a shooting war going on. It's brutal.

I remember reading an article penned by a female Captain in the USMC (I think) who ended up in the field trying to keep up with her male Marines but her body simply couldn't handle the strain.

If it was an individual making a choice on their own and they were willing to risk it, that would be fine...but war is not an individual endeavor. It's a team sport, and when somebody on the team breaks it impacts the whole team.