New Army Handgun Solicitation.

[RJ]

As far as I know there never was a LAPES drop without a viewing stand. I think that was the whole purpose--"See this neat stuff we can do with the weapon that Secretary McNamara thoughtfully forced us to buy?" As you can imagine, even when they worked they were more than a bit tough on the suspension and threw all those fancy optics for the Shillelagh missile out of whack. But McNamara said it was air-droppable so by God it was going to be air-droppable.

Another brilliant Pentagon procurement program.

What could go wrong?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dgg3iRaVnbw

[Drang]

But McNamara said it was air-droppable so by God it was going to be air-droppable.

Another brilliant Pentagon procurement program.

The Rooskies do it, so can we!

Knew a guy who once saw that stock propaganda footage the commies put out, showing their cargo chutes with built-in retro-rockets, and wondered aloud why we didn't have one?

I pointed out that he was assuming that a commie propaganda film was an accurate depiction of the reliability and utility of a device that would have to be a precision piece of equipment, and that of the half dozen or so nations worldwide that might be able to make such a critter work 99.99% of the time, none of them were affiliated with the Warsaw Pact.

[Sawyer]

I'm just bummed Smith couldn't get their act together. I wonder what did them in.

[TiroFijo]

I'm just bummed Smith couldn't get their act together. I wonder what did them in.

S&W+ General Dynamics... with a gorilla like that watching your back, the flaws must have been REALLY undisguisable.

[stimpee]

The answer is a definitive "because." The M9A3 might be the answer to some problems, but acquisition of such would require a contract (or a major contract modification). Contracts of this magnitude cannot TYPICALLY be sole-sourced. The requirement for competition means the military might as well look to see what's out there that might actually be (gasp) better than the Beretta.

This is incorrect (other than perhaps the "because" reasoning). The M9A3 was proposed as an Engineering Change Proposal under the terms of the existing contract as updates to the M9. It would not require a new contract or major contract modification. And the differences between the M9 and M9A3 are not restricted as being accepted as an "all or nothing" proposal. The combination of proposed updates meets >85% of the MHS requirements with the potential for additional compliance to over 90% with some further effort, and NO increase in product cost. There is no sole source required when the proposed updates clearly fall under the terms of the existing competitive contract.

BTW as far as "better" goes, the recent M9 pistol contract lot acceptance tests achieved a MRBS of 25000 rounds over 5 lot tests of 2500 pistols. The lot tests are performed under government supervision after a full interchange procedure that mixes and matches the major and minor components amongst 10 randomly chosen pistols. That is 10X the most stringent requirement for the MHS... In the mid 2000's, over 165,000 rounds were fired in 17 LATs with ZERO malfunctions under the same conditions.

[TCinVA]

BTW as far as "better" goes, the recent M9 pistol contract lot acceptance tests achieved a MRBS of 25000 rounds over 5 lot tests of 2500 pistols. The lot tests are performed under government supervision after a full interchange procedure that mixes and matches the major and minor components amongst 10 randomly chosen pistols. That is 10X the most stringent requirement for the MHS... In the mid 2000's, over 165,000 rounds were fired in 17 LATs with ZERO malfunctions under the same conditions.

I want to highlight this because god damn.

For those who don't know what MRBS is, let Todd explain it:

http://pistol-training.com/archives/6837

An MBRS of Twenty Five Thousand is amazing.

That's one of the primary reasons why the 92 series pistols have such a following. They are amazingly reliable weapons.

[fixer]

I want to highlight this because god damn.

For those who don't know what MRBS is, let Todd explain it:

http://pistol-training.com/archives/6837

An MBRS of Twenty Five Thousand is amazing.

That's one of the primary reasons why the 92 series pistols have such a following. They are amazingly reliable weapons.

exactly...man...that is superb...and that is with mixing parts between pistols. wow.

[GJM]

Beretta pistols are awesome. Only thing more awesome would be when they are actually shipping (again) after the move from MD. Any info when that will be?

[JSGlock34]

I'd be curious to hear more about the APX if stimpee has anything he can share. Does it live up to the standard set by the 92?

[stimpee]

Beretta pistols are awesome. Only thing more awesome would be when they are actually shipping (again) after the move from MD. Any info when that will be?

We are shipping, and have been for a few months, however we are still in ramp up mode, and some things are coming up more slowly than others. Couple that with huge back orders for the M9A3 and the Wilson Combat specials and it makes things look/feel quite far behind. Believe me, nobody wants to get product shipped more than us, but it must be done with the appropriate attention and care...

I'd be curious to hear more about the APX if stimpee has anything he can share. Does it live up to the standard set by the 92?

I cannot really share too much at this point. And although I was a die-hard striker fired pistol guy before I started at Beretta (2.5 year ago), as my knowledge of the 92/M9 and experience with it has grown, I am not one who would compare much of anything to the standard that pistol sets in my eyes. Not only is it mature in development and manufacturing, but it is also a ridiculously effective design. Couple that with the data tidbits I mentioned above (among others), and it is hard to compare it to anything.

That said, I have spent a decent amount of trigger time with the APX thus far, and have been involved in the development/testing process for a while. I like it. Quite a bit. However my opinion does not/will not matter. Feedback has been good thus far, and we are optimistic that it will be a solid product. Sorry for the tactical diversions of the thread!