Knowing you'll never win.

[ASH556]

Sorry for the potentially depressing thread, but I'd appreciate some perspective from like minded individuals. I'm struggling lately (last 2-3 years) with a concept across multiple areas of my life, but the concept is the same.

Concept: Better than average at something, but not good enough to be "pro" at it, and unwilling/unable to put in enough time to get to that level. Having achieved best possible results, then tempted to quit.

The current example for me is 3gun. About 10 months ago some buddies invited me to the local "outlaw" 3gun match. This one is set up "tactical" style with pre-established round counts, no makeup shots, and heavy penalties for misses. Well, this works well for me because it jives with my "tactical" training background. Having taken first place multiple times now, I decided to try my hand at the larger "3GN Nation" style match held in Atlanta. 31/100 is my best finish so far at that match. There are a couple factors working against me at that match:
1) Real, actual Pro sponsored shooters compete at that match. Rob Romero, James Casanova, and Erik Lund were at the last one (may have been other pros I don't recognize as well.
2) Match focuses less on accuracy and more on speed, and much more heavily on shotgun than pistol or rifle. At the last match I shot 108 rounds of 12ga, 80 rounds of pistol, and 20 rounds of rifle. Part of this is because it's all bay style with no long range shots, so rifle is just not used very much unless specified.

In order to improve at that match it is my impression that I'll have to spend a whole lot of time in my garage practicing loading my shotgun. Even then, I'd have to devote way more time and funds to practicing shooting to the exclusion of time/money spent with my family (wife, 2yr son, 7mo son).

Meanwhile I've got a dedicated 3gun rifle, 3gun shotgun, belt, shell caddies, etc, etc. If I'm not going to get better at it or win, then I may as well sell off all the gear and not even shoot another match. Spend the time/money on something more productive.

Am I being too black & white about this? Should I just keep doing it and improving little by little? Shooting the bigger match is more time (12 hrs on a match day) away from home, more gas spent driving, more ammo used/rounds fired, higher entry fee, and more costly gear. By contrast, the local outlaw "tactical" match is 15 minutes away, 3-4 hrs max, entry fee is less than 1/2, and uses less ammo while still practicing dynamic shooting (on the move, multiple targets, reloads, etc).

Where is the line between pushing yourself and beating your head against the wall?

[orionz06]

Where is the line between pushing yourself and beating your head against the wall?

Enjoyment and value. If you lose but will have an awesome time who cares? There are lots of things I do that I am terrible at but have a blast being terrible. It's the trip not the destination.

[Chuck Haggard]

Welcome to my world.

I went with "improves my overall firearms training plan for the real world while still having fun at doing so". One has a hard time winning USPSA matches when shooting a S&W 5906, but that didn't mean I didn't have fun, and was getting quality time in with my gear.

In 3gun the shotgun stuff is the worst stuff I see ref "gamer vs street" TTPs and gear, so you either get deep into the gamer part, or have fun with doing what you do.

[Peally]

My personal thinking is I'll never beat Stoeger or Vogel, but I don't care if I do. I compete to get better at shooting; it gives me skill benchmarks, drives me to be better every time I make a minute error, and I enjoy the high from beating the snot out of people I perceive as great shooters.

Everyone has a goal, and for me it's not to win nationals but to make M/GM (it was A, but since I made A class and am still/forever unimpressed with my shooting skills I had to raise the bar ). If your goal is to beat those crazy fast guys the only way that's going to happen is an intense drive and dedicated practice. Only thing that works for me is I'm easily angered by what I see as garbage shooting, despite my club match rankings.

All that being said, you need to keep your goals realistic. If you've got a family and spending your only days off with them is more important than beating some random fast guy at a shoot, that's not a bad thing. No reason to sell everything off if you're having fun shooting though.

As far as getting physically old affecting me, as long as I see crusty old farts like Miculek nuking the competition at matches and dancing on the ashes with trophies I'm not too worried about it.

ETA: Sorry if all this is disjointed, it's just random thoughts I'm spewing

[HCM]

Is it fun?

Are you shooting this for fun and the challenge or are you looking to go pro and get on the circuit?

I train with firearms as part of what I do for a living but I also like to shoot for fun. I guess everyone is different but I find in both areas shooting with better/higher-level shooters is encouraging and motivating.

[Mr_White]

Great topic, but a very subjective one. So no one is going to figure out your answer but you.

I think it really comes down to whether you find the whole business enjoyable enough to want to continue doing it. People get joy from all kinds of different parts of this activity - messing with the guns, the gear, improving their hardware, simply having the fun of participating and socializing, 'doing well' whatever that is to someone, winning outright, getting more confidence if they have to do it for real, seeing self-improvement realized, etc.

I relate to what you are talking about. There have been a number of activities across my whole life that I have 'gotten good at' - that is a big part of the enjoyment for me, seeing myself improve, and then gotten bored of and quit after the steep part of the learning curve is over and it's going to be much more difficult to improve from there. Two years is as long as an intense interest in a hobby usually lasts for me. Pistol shooting has been the thing I have stuck with the longest I'd say.

[joshs]

I've twice been at the same point with 3 gun, and I sold my shotgun and supporting equipment. Both times I ended up regretting it and buying a new shotgun and caddies. There's nothing wrong with shooting for fun, and, while my 3 gun shotgun is probably the least used gun I own, I still enjoy going to a match when I do have time.

[Kyle Reese]

You're getting out there and becoming more proficient running a handgun, carbine and shotgun under stress, doing something that the vast majority of gun owners and shooters can't (or won't) do. There's some intrinsic value there, IMO, plus a good way to meet and network with similar minded folks.

I'd rather shoot _______ matches, knowing that I'm not likely to win instead of spending a stuffy afternoon on a golf course.

[okie john]

It depends on what you want to get out of the experience. To win matches, remember that you shoot against the match rules, the course design, and the course designer at least as much as you shoot against the other shooters or even yourself. (When I was shooting a lot of matches, I had a favorite course designer. This guy was wickedly smart and devious. I almost made him cry a couple of times, which was infinitely more satisfying than taking 1st place in a match full of dumb/easy stages.) Beyond that, you have to keep beating your head against the wall to make your times and scores improve incrementally.

If you just want to learn to shoot better, then understand that match rules and course design could very well push you in directions other than where you want to go. If that happens, then develop your own set of standards and measure yourself against them. Take what you need from matches--which can be quite a lot--and leave the rest.


Okie John

[YVK]

Am I being too black & white about this? Should I just keep doing it and improving little by little?

Where is the line between pushing yourself and beating your head against the wall?

Q#1: I think so.
Q#2: Yes.
Q#3: Right there where the process of improvement is no longer enjoyable.

You won't win against pros unless you become one. For those of us who aren't pros, life interferes. You are already in the upper 1/3 of what appears to be a competitive group. You're doing fine.
I also have a 3G rifle, shotgun, holsters, belt, caddies, Turk vest etc. I shot exactly one local 3G match. My next one is on October. I don't care. It is just a fun thing to do, even though I'll compete as if my life is on the line.
When it comes to hobbies, I have not gotten incrementally better in anything over the years. Got better some, but not by much. In some areas I got worse because I don't do it as much. To me living a balanced, diversified life is more important than excelling in one particular hobby, and the journey is more important than the destination. Failure to achieve is nothing but a harmless feedback.

I hope you find your enjoyment again.

P.S. A lot of similar replies above as I was typing.