Last winter I bought a BCM upper (14.5" ELW-f with a 13" KMR) which I slapped on a Daniel Defense lower that I had. (The Original DD upper was sold off.) I liked this setup, paired with a T-1 and a Surefire Scout so much that I qualified with it and started carrying it at work as my Patrol Rifle.
The only issue is I let my wife shot it, once. Her only comment was, "Where's mine?" So I bought another matching upper. And as to have something to put it on, I bought a complete BCM lower receiver.
The BCM lower would not reliable seat Gen3 PMAG's. Also, depending on the particular gen3 PMAG, the magazine sat just low enough that the second round would not be picked up after firing the first round chambered. The amount of rounds in the magazine were not a factor.
After the second time I sent the lower to BCM, I had a long conversation with a member of their CS. He sent the lower to his engineering department. They stripped the lower and measured it. The attached note from the engineering department stated that since this was a mil spec lower receiver, BCM only recommends the use of mil spec magazines for proper function.
The CS rep stated that the lower was measured and that all measurements that were part of the TDP were with in spec. He said that there was a variation that naturally occurs during the forging process in which some forgings are slightly larger than others, and that this lower was on the longer side. He was referring to the measurement from the area of the lower where the trigger guard mounts on the back of the receiver, to the bottom of the magazine well. Since this measurement was not part of the original TDP, they deem it to be acceptable. As the original magazine spec in the TDP did not include an anti-insertion tab, the issue was with the design of the PMAG, and not of their lower receiver.
The issue was that it was just long enough to hit the over-insertion tab on the gen 3 PMAGs. He said this issue occurs with any and all manufactures. I explained that I also own a couple of DD guns, as well as a couple of Colt 6920's. In addition, I took the magazine that would not seat into this BCM lower to work and tried it in 6 different Agency owned S&W AR's. No issues with any of them seating the gen3 PMAG.
The CS rep was convinced that the issue was not with his product, but with the design of the gen 3 PMAG. He spent the majority of the conversation trying to convince me why the gen 3 PMAG should not be used in a carry/duty gun. Or that if I really needed to use gen3 PMAGs, that I should grind off the anti-insertion tabs on all of the mags first. They shipped the gun back to me, along with a hat.
I had planned on using this new receiver/upper combination as my Patrol Rifle at work. My agency issues gen 2 PMAGs with their pool rifles. I've been using the gen 3 mags since they came out. Now the concept of owning a carbine that can't use the same magazines as the rest of my guns, or that needs modified magazines to function just doesn't sit well with me at all.
I struck out with BCM's customer service. Big time...
The two upper assemblies was my first venture into purchasing anything from BCM's product line. These upper assemblies had me excited. My experience with this lower has left me extremely disappointed with the company. Not only did they loose a customer, but I can not in good faith recommend them to any of my officers.
I am going to sell off this lower (with full disclosure) and eat any loss. But I need another lower receiver to pair with the soon to be lowers upper.
Choices of reputable branded lowers are rather slim at this time.
DD doesn't sell separate lowers.
Colt doesn't either. I guess I could buy a complete Colt, like one of their 6920-OEM1 and sell off the upper. But that's more hassle than I have time for right now.
Noveske sells stripped lowers. But I am looking for a complete lower.
While S&W does sell complete lowers, I'm not in a rush to go that route. My agency has about 250-300 S&W carbines as pool rifles. They have their own issues at times.
LMT sells a complete lower called the "Defender" for a price that is competitive to the BCM. Right now, this LMT lower receiver seems like the best option. But I have zero experience with the LMT rifles or lowers.
Does anyone have any experience with the LMT Defender complete lowers? Are they comparable with gen 3 PMAGs? An just as important, can anyone comment on LMT's customer service?
Any other thoughts?
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Originally Posted by SLG
