Holdover / Holdunder transitions

[evanhill]

My carbine is an AR with a comp m3, so I've got the standard hold over issues at closer ranges.

My carry pistol is an SA lightweight 1911. It came from the factory shooting ~2" high at 25 yards. I decided to leave it as it came for a while to let the jury come in on that arrangement. Then I read Bill Wilson's recommendation for exactly that formula for a 1911, and heard the same thing from a knowledgeable friend who is on a "federal team with domestic responsibilities".

Getting used to the difference between POA / POI on the SA didn't take long and now I rather prefer it.

I'm now wondering if I would have trouble transitioning between the different holdover / holdunder arrangements between pistol and carbine if I had to use either under stress. It doesn't seem to be a problem on the square range, but we all know how well that applies to real life.

[SLG]

Evan, good to see you here.

I think the hold over issue on a carbine is often mistaught. Do you need to know it? Yes. Are there real situations where it has come in handy? Yes. Will you hold over most of the time in a real, close range gunfight? I don't think so. Everyone's experience is different, but of the lots of guys I deal with who shoot bad guys at close range, almost all say that they didn't give holdover a thought. The difference in POI probably just doesn't matter that much, most of the time.

[MKaeding]

I'm curious. What is the rationale for the 2" high zero at 25 yards with a handgun? I've explored the 3" high zero on a carbine at 100 yards. Is it the same rough rationale given the closer distances of a likely handgun engagement? I tried a quick internet search but could not readily locate anything. Thanks in advance.

[evanhill]

This isn't experience speaking, just what I've heard from a couple of others.

Bill Wilson likes 2" high in .45acp 1911 @ 25 yds because it gives him a 75 (50?) yard point blank range, and he's a hog and deer shootin' fool.

Additionally, in low light and stressful situations, people tend to shoot somewhat low as they drop their pistols a little bit to help acquire the target behind the sights. Finally, being able to use a "lollipop hold" allows for more precision at ranges where iron sights start to obscure the POI.