Class, Police Trades, and Carry Position.

[dgg9]

These were two of my thoughts as well. First, if this is your first handgun, I wouldn't start with a .40 S&W in order to afford other stuff.

....

If a friend of mine had $1K to spend on a starter pistol, accessories, and a training class, and was a NEW SHOOTER, I'd recommend a decent kydex OWB holster

100% agreed here. It seems counter-intuitive to turn down a free case of .40, but as a beginner you have to fight several learning curve battles at once, and the reduced recoil of 9mm seems one less battle, not to mention cheaper for every subsequent case.

At the beginning, kydex OWB at 3:30 makes classes easier. What you do in classes (and not so much in real life) is a huge series of draw, fire, reholster. The latter will be much easier with kydex OWB. Holsters are not expensive, and for common guns, there's a lot on the used market. You can always get an IWB later.

I also agree that first classes with regional trainers are a major bang for the buck. My first-ever real class was Jeff Gonzales's CP1, and I was overmatched, both in skill and my gear choices. I would have been better served with a local class or two to at least debug my gear and my fundamentals.

[Kimura]

I was recently referred here by another member and have been lurking for a while. I joined and did a couple of searches and couldn't really find what I was looking for.

I have just over 1,000 saved now for a quality gun, belt, holster, and class. The classes I am looking at run anywhere from 500 and up. The belt and holster budget is about 100-150 tops. This leaves only about 400 for the gun itself and hence I am looking at police trades as most are carried more than shot. While some would find it unforunate that they are 40 S&W, my father happens to shoot and reload 40 and has a nice stash which he has agreed to give me the 1,000 +/- rounds needed for training.

The police trades offer good value as most come with steel night sights and 3 mags. The ones I am looking at are:

M&P 40
M&P 40c
G22 Gen3
G23 Gen3

Which of those would probably give me the longest duration being chambered in 40? The interwebz mostly seems to favor the M&P but I can't help but think about the G23 size since its the equivalent of the highly esteemed G19. And I have read that you can send Glock police trades back to Glock and they will give them a "tune up". Can anyone validate that?

My next conundrum is carry position. I know this is subjective and will likely require some trial and error on my part. I have small children which means a lot of bending down (seems like this would be a PITA for appendix) and only having one hand available as the other is usually holding a kid. I am sure someone here can chime in who is in a similar situation and offer sound advice as to a carry position.

Sorry for the novel, just want to get it right out of the gate. Thanks PF!

I think Kevin/psalms had some really good advice in his post. You say your Dad reloads and shoots .40; does that mean you do as well and this is just your first purchase or...?

The Glock versus M&P thing is kind of a toss up to me. I am not a huge fan of the M&P, mostly because of the issues the 9mm has had and S&W's handling of the problem or lack thereof. So it has kind of soured me on the pistol, but I'll also say that I think the M&P has a lot less recoil than a Glock in .40. And I also tend to like Glock but if buying a Gen 3, 23 i would be very tempted to try the Sprinco dual recoil spring system in it, which is another $80.00. Gen 4s already have a dual recoil system and that tells me something. Honestly, a friend of mine who has years of shooting experience asked me a couple of months back what I thought was the best ALL AROUND service pistol. My answer without hesitation was the Glock 17 or 19. I don't think they're perfect or even the perfect choice for everything, but I think all around it's a very hard choice to beat. And by all around I mean everything from price to ease of maintenance to parts/mag prices and on and on.

Holster to me can be leather or kydex though kydex is easier on the wallet. I have the belt slide version of the above mentioned ALS and I think it's my favorite holster for everything except concealment which it really sucks at. I HATE AIWB, so strong side is the best choice for me. IWB or OWB, what holster, positioning and cant are going to be something that you will have to experiment with. For a basic range holster I like the ALS. I like the ALS locking system, but hate thumb break holsters. And I bought a lot of thumb break OWB holsters before I figured out I hate them. YMMV but save yourself a ton of money by skipping the cheap holsters and belts and no matter whether it's kydex or leather, just go good quality stuff.

Good luck, hope something in there is helpful for you.

[HopetonBrown]

A used Glock 17/19, 3 o'clock OWB holster, a 1 day class with a local POST certified instructor.

[Totem Polar]

A used Glock 17/19, 3 o'clock OWB holster, a 1 day class with a local POST certified instructor.

Add a decent belt, and this.

[Mike C]

I don't know where in NC you are but if you are close to a Lawman's they have some pretty amazing prices on police trade in Glocks and M&P's.

[Chuck Haggard]

I've seen the Springco units turn Glocks that worked into Glocks that don't

[Virtuosity Student]

Thanks to everyone thusfar for your advice and contributions.

Whichever class(es) you take, ping the instructor and see if you may use reloads. Many (most of the good ones...) do not allow them.

Why: Outright liability aside (KABOOM), if your gun ends up choked on homebrew ammo...they have an entire rest-of-the-class to teach, people who paid just as much for instruction as you did. He/she cannot in good conscience focus on an individual's equipment shortfalls at the expense of other paying customers, and it'd be rude/illogical of any student to think that they should (unless they have other staff on hand, who may be spared from assisting with providing instruction; not always the case).

Some teachers don't care, though. It's worth asking.

Sound advice. I honestly had never considered the possibility of not allowing reloads and I would not want to detract from anyone else's experience who paid their hard earned money for the class. Will look into that.

OP doesn't specify, but if this is a first gun / first class affair, then two things pop to mind:

I should have specified this in the OP. I have shot guns for years, mainly rifle and shotgun, however I am also not a novice to handguns. I have some trigger time on my dad's Sig 229 in 40 S&W as well as single action revolvers in 44 Mag and 45 LC, although it was nothing more than plinking and approaching the round counts that a 2-3 day class would require. So I am not a complete stranger to recoil and at 6'3" #240, I manage pretty well.

The purchase in question will be my first handgun that I own with the intention of CCW. But I want to seek good training so that I am not caught with my pants down if in fact, God forbid, I ever have to use it. I don't want to revert back to plinking with pops as my only reference to save me or mine if that time comes.

What's the cost differential between the police trade in .40s and a similar platform, used, in 9mm?

I'd recommend a decent kydex OWB holster (heck - for about $40 you could get a perfectly good "range" holster like an ALS-equipped Safariland - like this one: http://www.opticsplanet.com/safarila...-glock-19.html), a decent belt (like this https://www.daltechforce.com/strongest-gun-belt for $50), and a couple-three kydex mag pouches (http://www.kytexgear.com/products-pa...arriers/glock/). Then, instead of a $500 1000-round-two-day course, I'd find a decent basic marksmanship and gun handling course (the NRA 101 would do the trick), and spend the "savings" on either a lightly used G19/G17, or a VP9, or a P320.

Learn the basics with the guidance of someone local, practice until your skills plateau, THEN spend the money on a "name" trainer to get you to the next level. Dry fire confirmed with live fire on the range, with someone you can go back to to verify you're doing things correctly (or to help you fix things that go wrong) is key.

Price difference seems to be a moot. But the options are limited and usually sell out quick whereas with many depts. seemingly dumping 40 for 9mm, the 40's seem to have better availability and more options.

Thanks for the links! Great stuff!!

It seems counter-intuitive to turn down a free case of .40

This has been my struggle. Free case to get started with and as long as I provide the brass and it's in good shape...free reloads. Free reloads = more practice.

Keep it coming guys. Again the purpose is to get quality training and have this gun for CCW. Does that change anyone's opinion on OWB vs IWB?

[Lester Polfus]

You are going at this with a very smart plan.

I would concur with what everybody has said about .40 vs 9mm.

Regarding holsters, if you've the time, I would suggest cruising Ebay, Gunbroker, and the "classifieds" section of the various internet gun fora. I've gotten some very nice used holsters for pennies on the dollar compared to their original price. Also, you can often buy a holster used and if you find out it doesn't work for you, re-sell it for what you have in it, or sometimes even make a dollar or five.

[Malamute]

This has been my struggle. Free case to get started with and as long as I provide the brass and it's in good shape...free reloads. Free reloads = more practice.

What loader is he using? It may be cost effective to buy the required dies/toolhead etc for 9mm if he would load for you. In a Dillon, the entire toolhead can be swapped out fairly simply once the initial investment in the parts is made.

There may be someone here that has plenty of 9mm brass to sell cheap to get you started along the reloading path. I had a freind that collected and sold his departments fired brass. He asked me once what I thought a 5 gallon bucket of brass would be worth. I think he said he sold it for maybe $50 or $75. It was mixed 5.56 and pistol brass. He had way more than he needed for his own reloading.

[ReverendMeat]

If you already have experience handling firearms safely and have a decent grasp on handgun marksmanship fundamentals, I'd divert the cost of the class into a case or two of 9x19, a belt, and holster (3:00-5:00, OWB/IWB dependent on how you dress) Choice of pistol after that is a wash.