My duty pistol was a 4566 for a lot of years--worked very well and complemented the off-duty 3913.
My duty pistol was a 4566 for a lot of years--worked very well and complemented the off-duty 3913.
Facts matter...Feelings Can Lie
Originally Posted by DocGKR
And in the case of the Buffalo Bore JHP load, you may not know what particular bullet you're getting.
IMO problems of some of the boutique ammo makers offerings include - sometimes using inferior bullets for the particular application (such as Montana Gold), driving good bullets too fast, and often an outrageous price.
Even if such a boutique maker used a GoldDot or XTP, why pay 2-3 times (for example) what you would for Speer Gold Dot that's even on The List ?
The stuff is marketed as somehow being 'more powerful' for outdoors applications.
I've used BB lead cast loads using Keith SWCs. When ammo & handloading components were scare I bought them, and if time was scarce for handloading my own I might buy a box. But, I haven't and wouldn't buy his JHP loads for the reasons I mentioned.
Pretty sure Gary has been making that exact point for the last 5-10 years.
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
Or more............
I am the owner of Agile/Training and Consulting
www.agiletactical.com
I don't know if there is any data on the subject, but having seen some of the arrestees going into our local court, I'm wondering if the population of "supersized" bad guys has been increasing, and thus whether it is better to err on the upper side of that range? Some of the guys I've seen in orange jump suits are truly enormous--well north of 300 pounds I'd say.
They can be, or skinny meth/crack heads, which is why ammo needs to be "general purpose".
I am the owner of Agile/Training and Consulting
www.agiletactical.com
The results of my quick operational "test-" Five rounds of the Buffalo Bore 230gr +P JHP at 5-6 yards distance, shooting fairly quickly offhand unsupported, using my intended platform, my Gen 3 Glock G21.
Yeah, I yanked the first round....
While 5 rounds is hardly exhaustive in any sense, I'm satisfied as to the cycleability of the rounds in my G21, and the accuracy (assuming I do my part...) is sufficient.
Interestingly, in the same session, I went through some Federal Champion 230 gr aluminum cased/small pistol primered ball in both my G21 and in my SIG GSR XO (I was primarily testing magazine reliability of a new potential Check-Mate magazine/magazine series in the SIG)-I don't think it's my imagination-that Federal stuff is really on the spicy side; recoil impulse and blast seemed to be at least in the same ballpark as the Buffalo Bore. It's a relatively new loading that I believe is a Walmart contract (and perhaps unique to Walmart) cartridge. I've been using it for the past several months, and its been reliable and decently accurate, although the Federal Champion brass-cased stuff (which uses larger primers) seems to be a tad more accurate.
My intention at this point will be to have this Buffalo Bore 230gr JHP as my primary/initial chambered and carry load for my trip, where it can perform double-duty as both 2-legged and 4-legged potential predators. Given my research and everyone's input (which I'm very appreciative of the microscope the forum participants have put this discussion thread under), I think it'll suffice. Back-up will be Remington Golden Saber 230 gr and Federal Hydra Shok 230gr, both standard pressure loads.
Best, Jon
Yeah. I don't want to use "bait and switch" but I bought some BB .357 ammo from midway back during the First Obama Panic of 2008, and midway used stock photos of Gold Dot bullets. The actual delivered product was Montana Gold bullets.
Too many "boutique" manufacturers use bullets interchangeably. So long as they're the same weight they're the same, right?
Ugh.
Yes, it has to be a compromise. I'm wondering, though, whether overall the bad guys are getting bigger and thus the compromise number should start going up. I don't have any idea what the data say, or if there is any useful data on the subject. I have always been comfortable with 12 inches of penetration in the past, but are the numbers of giant economy sized thugs increasing to the point there is a reasonable chance it might not be enough?
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