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Thread: Fairfax County Ad Hoc Police Commission

  1. #391
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    Quote Originally Posted by TCinVA View Post
    Officer A responds to a burglary call, and catches Crackhead Dave exiting the location with an arm full of stuff. Chase happens, Crackhead Dave gets caught after fighting with the cops. They haul him back to the car he was using (it's his baby's momma's grandmother's car he took without permission) and in the trunk there's more stuff. There's also a decent quantity of dope.
    How do the officers know that Crackhead Dave wasn't a crackhead, but is Military Veteran Dave that had too much to drink the night before and was moving to a temporary dwelling?

    Who made the call to the police, did officers speak to the caller in person and determine that this was a reliable witness to an offense and had legal standing as a complainant or property representative? Crackheads (and military veterans) can legally own TVs and can move them from one place to another. What if it's some babymama drama and Dave is taking property because he can't laid or borrow the food stamps? Maybe the officers should do some police work and make sure that an offense occurred before they think about doing something that might inconvenience Dave or hurt his feelings. I think the cops should let Crackhead Dave walk away. The officers should locate a complainant (or leave a note on the door) and tell him come down to the station during normal business hours, speak to a detective and complete an affidavit stating that the now unidentified suspect did not have permission to enter his home/dwelling/business/etc and take property. Then the detective can suspend the offense due to a lack of investigative leads and tell the complainant to file it with his insurance.

    In terms of fair weather police work, everything is ok if Dave turned out to be an actual crackhead that was committing an offense. Heaven forbid that it turns into another Henry Louis Gates incident where the police are acting stupidly and racial profiling a pillar of the community.

  2. #392
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    In terms of fair weather police work, everything is ok if Dave turned out to be an actual crackhead that was committing an offense. Heaven forbid that it turns into another Henry Louis Gates incident where the police are acting stupidly and racial profiling a pillar of the community.
    So, you are certain that Henry Louis Gates was racially profiled? Wikipedia quotes from the incident below.

    Police report and 9-1-1 dispatcher recordings[edit]
    On the porch of a yellow-clapboard house stands a middle-aged African American man in polo shirt and slacks, in the middle of a statement, his mouth agape, his hands handcuffed to the front. Behind him stands a uniformed Caucasian policeman, lightly grasping the man's upper arm. Facing the pair is an officer to the right, his left hand held up in a "hold on" gesture. Another African American officer is in the foreground, below the level of the porch, with his arms akimbo and his back to the scene while he faces the general direction of the camera.
    Gates, arrested on the porch of his Cambridge home,[11] with Sgt. Crowley (right) and Sgt. Lashley (foreground).
    A pair of mugshots giving front and profile views of a middle-aged African American man with very short-trimmed dark hair very short-trimmed grey goatee and mustache, a neutrally nondescript or matter-of-fact expression on his face, wearing very lightweight wire-rimmed eyeglasses and an orange-and-white variegated-pinstripe polo shirt.
    Gates' booking photo taken the day of the arrest.
    According to the police report, Crowley arrived at the scene, went up to the front door, and asked Gates to step outside. Crowley explained he was investigating the report of a break-in in progress; as he did so, Gates opened the front door and said, "Why, because I'm a black man in America?"[1][12]

    Crowley's report states that he believed Gates was lawfully in the residence, but that he was surprised and confused by Gates' behavior, which included a threat that Crowley did not know who he was "messing with." Crowley then asked Gates for a photo ID so as to verify he was the resident of the house; Gates initially refused, but then did supply his Harvard University identification card. Crowley wrote that Gates repeatedly shouted requests for his identification. Crowley then told Gates that he was leaving his residence and that if Gates wanted to continue discussing the matter, he would speak to him outside. Gates replied, "Yeah, I'll speak with your mama outside."[1] On the 9-1-1 dispatcher audio recordings, a man's loud voice is heard in the background at several points during Sgt. Crowley's transmissions.[13]

    Gates stepped onto his front porch and continued to yell at him, accusing him of racial bias and saying he had not heard the last of him. Faced with this tumultuous behavior from Gates now outside his residence, Crowley warned Gates that he was becoming disorderly. When Gates ignored this warning and persisted in his behavior, and likewise ignored a second warning from Crowley, Crowley informed him that he was under arrest.[1]

    Gates' accounts[edit]
    Gates' account of the events first appeared in The Root on July 20. According to the statement, Gates saw Crowley at the door as he was speaking to the Harvard Real Estate Office to have his front door fixed. When he opened the front door, Crowley immediately asked him to step outside. Gates did not comply and asked Crowley why he was there. When told that Crowley was a police officer investigating a reported breaking and entering, Gates replied that it was his house, and he was a Harvard faculty member. Crowley asked Gates whether he could prove it; Gates told him he could, and turned to go to the kitchen to fetch his wallet. Crowley followed him into the house. Gates then handed Crowley his Harvard University ID and a current driver's license, both including his photograph, the license also giving his address.[14]

    Gates then asked Crowley for his name and badge number, but Crowley did not respond. Following repeated requests for Crowley's name and badge number, the officer left the kitchen; Gates followed him to the front door. As he stepped out the front door and asked the other officers for Crowley's name and badge number, Crowley said, "Thank you for accommodating my earlier request," and arrested Gates on his front porch.[14]

    In an interview published in The Root on July 21, Gates said that when Crowley first asked him to step outside onto the porch, "the way he said it, I knew he wasn't canvassing for the police benevolent association. All the hairs stood up on the back of my neck, and I realized that I was in danger. And I said to him no, out of instinct. I said, 'No, I will not.'" "He demanded that I step out on the porch, and I don't think he would have done that if I was a white person." Gates called the references to loud and tumultuous behavior in the police report a "joke"; he had been physically incapable of yelling at the time, due to a severe bronchial infection. As he was walked to the car in handcuffs, he asked, "Is this how you treat a black man in America?"[15] In an interview with columnist Maureen Dowd, Gates denied he had made a reference to the mother of the arresting officer.[16]

    Lucia Whalen[edit]
    Lucia Whalen was the witness and original 9-1-1 caller reporting the incident. Sgt. Crowley stated in his official police report that when he arrived at the scene, he spoke to Whalen, who told him she had "observed what appeared to be two black males with backpacks" trying to force entry.[1][17] Whalen subsequently denied making any such comment to Crowley.[17][18] Whalen was hurt by widespread comments labeling her a racist, based on the "two black males with backpacks" quote in the police report.[18] A recording of her 9-1-1 call was released on July 27; in it, Whalen could be heard saying, "I don't know if they live there and they just had a hard time with their key."[17] When asked for a more detailed description by the dispatcher, her reply on the tape was, "One looked kind of Hispanic, but I'm not really sure. And the other one entered and I didn't see what he looked like at all."[17][19]
    #RESIST

  3. #393
    Site Supporter KevinB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    How do the officers know that Crackhead Dave wasn't a crackhead, but is Military Veteran Dave that had too much to drink the night before and was moving to a temporary dwelling?

    Who made the call to the police, did officers speak to the caller in person and determine that this was a reliable witness to an offense and had legal standing as a complainant or property representative? Crackheads (and military veterans) can legally own TVs and can move them from one place to another. What if it's some babymama drama and Dave is taking property because he can't laid or borrow the food stamps? Maybe the officers should do some police work and make sure that an offense occurred before they think about doing something that might inconvenience Dave or hurt his feelings. I think the cops should let Crackhead Dave walk away. The officers should locate a complainant (or leave a note on the door) and tell him come down to the station during normal business hours, speak to a detective and complete an affidavit stating that the now unidentified suspect did not have permission to enter his home/dwelling/business/etc and take property. Then the detective can suspend the offense due to a lack of investigative leads and tell the complainant to file it with his insurance.

    In terms of fair weather police work, everything is ok if Dave turned out to be an actual crackhead that was committing an offense. Heaven forbid that it turns into another Henry Louis Gates incident where the police are acting stupidly and racial profiling a pillar of the community.
    What happens if Crackhead Dave is a rapist who has the RO tied up in back?

    Just come back in the morning?
    Kevin S. Boland
    Director of R&D
    Law Tactical LLC
    www.lawtactical.com
    kevin@lawtactical.com
    407-451-4544




  4. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    How do the officers know that Crackhead Dave wasn't a crackhead, but is Military Veteran Dave that had too much to drink the night before and was moving to a temporary dwelling?

    Who made the call to the police, did officers speak to the caller in person and determine that this was a reliable witness to an offense and had legal standing as a complainant or property representative? Crackheads (and military veterans) can legally own TVs and can move them from one place to another. What if it's some babymama drama and Dave is taking property because he can't laid or borrow the food stamps? Maybe the officers should do some police work and make sure that an offense occurred before they think about doing something that might inconvenience Dave or hurt his feelings. I think the cops should let Crackhead Dave walk away. The officers should locate a complainant (or leave a note on the door) and tell him come down to the station during normal business hours, speak to a detective and complete an affidavit stating that the now unidentified suspect did not have permission to enter his home/dwelling/business/etc and take property. Then the detective can suspend the offense due to a lack of investigative leads and tell the complainant to file it with his insurance.

    In terms of fair weather police work, everything is ok if Dave turned out to be an actual crackhead that was committing an offense. Heaven forbid that it turns into another Henry Louis Gates incident where the police are acting stupidly and racial profiling a pillar of the community.
    I could be reading this wrong, but I think this is one of those cases where purple font for sarcasm might help

  5. #395
    Site Supporter KevinB's Avatar
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    I'm really hoping it was sarcasm - but I did not read it that way.
    Kevin S. Boland
    Director of R&D
    Law Tactical LLC
    www.lawtactical.com
    kevin@lawtactical.com
    407-451-4544




  6. #396
    Site Supporter Coyotesfan97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    I could be reading this wrong, but I think this is one of those cases where purple font for sarcasm might help
    I really hope this is sarcasm so before I post a response I'll ask Paul.

    Sarcasm or serious?
    Just a dog chauffeur that used to hold the dumb end of the leash.

  7. #397
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    It's sarcasm and if it wasn't would it have been worth responding to?

  8. #398
    Murder Machine, Harmless Fuzzball TCinVA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    It's sarcasm and if it wasn't would it have been worth responding to?
    I laughed out loud when I read it.
    3/15/2016

  9. #399
    Site Supporter Coyotesfan97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul View Post
    It's sarcasm and if it wasn't would it have been worth responding to?
    Sweet. There's some truth there but I'll respond for people reading a thread
    Just a dog chauffeur that used to hold the dumb end of the leash.

  10. #400
    Quote Originally Posted by cclaxton View Post
    Crap. I had this all typed up for Southnarc and when I posted my token had expired....Grrrrr...,
    Tomorrow.
    Cody
    What's the good word, dude?

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