RDS-equipped carry pistols… what's next?

[Len McM]

Very interesting thread. One thing that I am taking away from this is that "It's the mileage, not the age" applies to these RDS's life span. These optics are judged by round counts until failure.

My only experience with a RDS on a pistol is on borrowed rimfire .22s which don't have the same recoil as a center fire pistols. I liked it. I liked it enough to consider using one on a center fire pistol. However my yearly round count outside of class time is nothing even close to the majority of shooters here. A case per year outside of classes in a good year, often less.

As I approach middle age my eyes are starting to do weird things. New glasses help, but the RDS equipped pistols helped too. I'm just trying to justify the "cost per round" for a RDS and slide. I'm debating of it is worth spending the cash for a pistol that I shoot relatively little.

I really don't have anything to contribute, but just wanted to mention that I'm enjoying the thread and discussion.

[DocGKR]

"Perhaps ours were duds."

You likely were using the second generation RMR's that had significant problems and failed early, just like ours from that generation did.

[Mercaptan]

"I like the idea of mounting a scope on a gun, but won't the flint get sparks in your eye when it hits the frizzen?"

You're trying to shoehorn a new technology into the existing paradigm, rather than going from the ground up with a clean sheet of paper...

Wouldn't it be neat to have the optic sit on a mount that acts like a non-reciprocating charging handle?

If you have a malfunction or need to manipulate the slide in another way, just grab the big optic sitting there.

/random musings

[jh9]

Is the SVI sight tracker patented?

Not that I've used one, but it appears to be an ideal solution if you can expand the rib to get enough real estate for mounting a dot. It would also leave the rear of the slide free for manipulating the gun in a normal manner.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showpost...4&postcount=17

(3rd pic in the link.) Widen the rib, slap some pic rail on there and you've got a mount.

[HopetonBrown]

Don't think a Sight Tracker design would work as well on tilt barrel pistols like Glock.

[LSP972]

As I approach middle age my eyes are starting to do weird things.

Welcome to the club. This is why I got interested in the concept in the first place. The red dot sight is THE answer for "old man eyes". I've been toying with the system for over three years now, not really wanting to go all-in for several reasons. But I have carried and shot my three pistols enough to be satisfied that they are durable and reliable enough for EDC.

The problem with having special glasses made (did that), is that they are NOT useful for walking around/everyday business. And the whole purpose of carrying a concealed handgun is to be able to INSTANTLY respond to a deadly threat…IOW, no King's X while you dig your special shootin' glasses out and don them. Trust me… once your eyes get to the point that a good sight picture means you can barely stay on a silhouette… its time to do something.

I'm about there; the only iron-sighted pistols in my battery that I can print an acceptable-to-me group with at 25 yards and beyond are my HK P30 and HK45C, due to the HUGE dots on their issue sights. I can do barely acceptable groups with issue Glock plastic sights, but your basic Trijicon/MeproLight/etc. standard sights are just a fuzzy blur. All black sights? Forget it. In bright ambient light, fiber optic front sights are nice and I can see them… too bad that 70% of lethal force encounters take place in dim light, where these are worse than useless (unless you're using a light, which you may or may not have the luxury of).

The RDS solves all of this in fell swoop. The downside is acquisition cost and the time/ammunition needed to become familiar with it… because, make no mistake, it IS different and will require you to expend no little bit of time and effort learning its idiosyncrasies. If you haven't, I suggest you read the large thread on the topic farther back in these pages. Doc, myself, and others who have some time on the various systems give quite a bit of insight into just what to expect.

This morning was my annual retiree re-qualification for CCW recertification. I shot a Bowie Signature Special with Trijicon clone of a JPoint inlet into the slide. I had two of these built some years back, and while they are not exactly state of the current art, optic-wise, they are about the handiest carrying Glock 19s with RDS I've yet to come across. I've been carrying one of them for the past week, and shot its twin this morning. While a lot of folks commented on the nice, tight 60-shot group (fired from 25 yards to 2 yards), nobody but one of the line officers even appeared to notice that the pistol had an optic mounted.

On a relatively easy, controlled qualification course like this one, an RDS is, pure and simply, cheating. The more realistic the course of fire, the more challenging the pistol becomes to shoot… but what else is new? Nothing, of course.

Anyway, I'm sold. Actually, I have been sold for some time, but just wasn't ready to make the switch. Now I am… at the expense of taking a lot of flak from all my Glock-shooting pals who I have been ribbing about their EuroPellet combat tupperware. I carried a Glock 9mm for a long time back on the job, but have been using HK in .45 exclusively for the past eight years. Time to eat some crow… all in good fun, of course.

And it was nice not to have to drag a small bag full of lo-cap magazines around with me, and not feel some discomfort after shooting 60 rounds in about five minutes. Before anyone (mainly youngsters) scoff at that, be advised… there WILL come a point in your life- if you make it that far- when heavy caliber recoil will start to bother you. Believe it.

.

[DocGKR]

It's kind of sad really when the old guys are out shooting the younger full time folks on qualification tests--I just smile sweetly and tell them that I cheat...

[Tamara]

Don't think a Sight Tracker design would work as well on tilt barrel pistols like Glock.

As opposed to tilt-barrel pistols like an SVI 2011?

Cut the slide like so and away you go...



But why not an entirely new gun design? Why are we constrained to tilting-barrel short recoil with a reciprocating slide? How about a tube receiver with a roller-locked or -delayed bolt inside?

[LSP972]

But why not an entirely new gun design? Why are we constrained to tilting-barrel short recoil with a reciprocating slide? How about a tube receiver with a roller-locked or -delayed bolt inside?

Because Cletus and Lurlene (PERFECT name for the female of the species- kudoes to you) ain't gonna spring for what that will cost, when they can buy tupperware for five or six hundred bucks new.

Wait… judging by the Cleeti and Lurlenes infesting the HKPro board since the arrival of the VP9, you never know…


.

[LSP552]

The RDS solves all of this in fell swoop. The downside is acquisition cost and the time/ammunition needed to become familiar with it… because, make no mistake, it IS different and will require you to expend no little bit of time and effort learning its idiosyncrasies. If you haven't, I suggest you read the large thread on the topic farther back in these pages. Doc, myself, and others who have some time on the various systems give quite a bit of insight into just what to expect.

This morning was my annual retiree re-qualification for CCW recertification. I shot a Bowie Signature Special with Trijicon clone of a JPoint inlet into the slide. I had two of these built some years back, and while they are not exactly state of the current art, optic-wise, they are about the handiest carrying Glock 19s with RDS I've yet to come across. I've been carrying one of them for the past week, and shot its twin this morning. While a lot of folks commented on the nice, tight 60-shot group (fired from 25 yards to 2 yards), nobody but one of the line officers even appeared to notice that the pistol had an optic mounted.

On a relatively easy, controlled qualification course like this one, an RDS is, pure and simply, cheating. The more realistic the course of fire, the more challenging the pistol becomes to shoot… but what else is new? Nothing, of course.

.

I'm not far behind you. Trying to decide if I want to chop up my 2nd gen 19 or pick up a new 4th gen 19 and send it off. We need grab lunch next week so you can help me spend money...

The 1,000 round T&E I did with your gun last year convinced me. I was just waiting for my eyes to catch up, and they have.