Velocity vs. KE in rifle rounds, terminally speaking...

[DocGKR]

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....-mm-Duty-Loads

My first choice would be the 5.56 mm Federal 62 gr Trophy Bonded Bear Claw (TBBC) bonded JSP (XM556FBIT3), followed by the 5.56 mm Winchester 64 gr solid base bonded JSP (Q3313/RA556B) developed for the FBI, along with the outstanding Black Hills 5.56 mm 50 gr TSX loading, and the Hornady 5.56 mm 55 gr GMX.

I would also be OK with the .223 55 & 62 gr Federal bonded JSP Tactical loads (LE223T1 & LE223T3), along with loads using Nosler 60 gr Partition JSP, Remington 62 gr Core-Lokt Ultra Bonded JSP (PRC223R4), .223 Federal 55 gr TSX (T223S), .223 Horn 55 gr GMX, .223 Speer 75 & 62/64 gr Gold Dot JSP's (and identically constructed Federal 62 gr Fusion JSP and Federal XM223SP1 62gr Bonded JSP), along with loads using the Swift 75 gr Scirocco bonded PT.

[Unobtanium]

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....-mm-Duty-Loads

My first choice would be the 5.56 mm Federal 62 gr Trophy Bonded Bear Claw (TBBC) bonded JSP (XM556FBIT3), followed by the 5.56 mm Winchester 64 gr solid base bonded JSP (Q3313/RA556B) developed for the FBI, along with the outstanding Black Hills 5.56 mm 50 gr TSX loading, and the Hornady 5.56 mm 55 gr GMX.

I would also be OK with the .223 55 & 62 gr Federal bonded JSP Tactical loads (LE223T1 & LE223T3), along with loads using Nosler 60 gr Partition JSP, Remington 62 gr Core-Lokt Ultra Bonded JSP (PRC223R4), .223 Federal 55 gr TSX (T223S), .223 Horn 55 gr GMX, .223 Speer 75 & 62/64 gr Gold Dot JSP's (and identically constructed Federal 62 gr Fusion JSP and Federal XM223SP1 62gr Bonded JSP), along with loads using the Swift 75 gr Scirocco bonded PT.

If the XM556FBIT3 is your 10 out of 10, what is the RA556B to you?

Also, do you think the tipped TBBC will make it into 5.56 loadings for the FBI, or are they not very prone to "rolling upgrades"?

[BWT]

I think velocity and KE are as relevant as the criteria allows them to be.

It's useful info to know, but it doesn't tell the whole story.

I think that's what puts me in the "ft/lbs don't mean a lot to me" camp.

Because it's contextual information. If you have a JHP that's velocity is so high that it fragments within the first 2-5" of gel; not reaching critical organs. Who cares if it shoots flat, has a bazillions ft/lbs of energy; it doesn't retain weight or have high permanent wound cavitation because only the base of the bullet makes it.

There's a lot of factors to consider.

I'm also reluctant about relying on permanent tissue damage/cavitation caused by a projectile's traveling through a medium and not expanding/fragmenting.

Just because velocities, clothing, varying distances, etc. throw monkey wrenches in those kinds of thing.

However, I'm not DocGKR and I don't study ballistics.

ETA: I think projectile weight and design and the make up of the intended target dictate to the end user the relevance of KE versus Velocity.

[Unobtanium]

I think velocity and KE are as relevant as the criteria allows them to be.

It's useful info to know, but it doesn't tell the whole story.

I think that's what puts me in the "ft/lbs don't mean a lot to me" camp.

Because it's contextual information. If you have a JHP that's velocity is so high that it fragments within the first 2-5" of gel; not reaching critical organs. Who cares if it shoots flat, has a bazillions ft/lbs of energy; it doesn't retain weight or have high permanent wound cavitation because only the base of the bullet makes it.

There's a lot of factors to consider.

I'm also reluctant about relying on permanent tissue damage/cavitation caused by a projectile's traveling through a medium and not expanding/fragmenting.

Just because velocities, clothing, varying distances, etc. throw monkey wrenches in those kinds of thing.

However, I'm not DocGKR and I don't study ballistics.

ETA: I think projectile weight and design and the make up of the intended target dictate to the end user the relevance of KE versus Velocity.

But what about a 64gr Gold Dot which leaves the barrel at 2500fps, or the 50gr TSX, which leaves the barrel at over 3,000fps, and both expanding and penetrating nearly identically?

[BWT]

But what about a 64gr Gold Dot which leaves the barrel at 2500fps, or the 50gr TSX, which leaves the barrel at over 3,000fps, and both expanding and penetrating nearly identically?

One has a lead exposed tip (and bonded base? Not sure, and I need time to check) JSP with a lead core. One is a solid copper JHP triple bonded bullet that weighs 50 gr.

That's kind of what Im getting at when I brought up context; different projectiles.

ETA: They also use two different methods for expansion. One with an exposed lead tip that that mushrooms out and one that has a Hollow cavity that expands into petals.

Do they also perform the same in all mediums? Auto Glass, Four layer Denim, and bare gel?

I'd guess not.

[rwa]

Old thread and late to the party, but I just went through the light vs. heavy with Nosler when using TSX and/or TTSX on game. The answer is also on their web site. Barnes' take is simple, they recommend using a bullet one step lighter than the normal selection for the caliber involved in order to boost velocity. Nosler's position is that if the lighter bullet will pass through, use it to take advantage of higher velocities thereby increasing distance. The wound channel is the same with both bullets.