Bill drill Comparison data

[GJM]

In the VP9 versus 320 thread, a request was made for comparative data on known drills. After it warmed up to the high 20's and the wind died down, I decided to have a 7 yard Bill drill shootfest. Why that drill and distance -- because it was easy and I didn't care to stomp around further in the snow.

Here are the results in the order I shot them. After the first three runs I think the cold was messing with the Pact timer, and while I could get total time, the splits were acting up. Everything was shot from open OWB, mostly with Atlanta Arms 147, and then 115 PMC when I ran out. All six shot Bill drills at 7 yards.


Sig 320
2.17 (1.12,.21.22,.19,.23,.20)
2.05 (1.02,.22,.21,.20,.20,.20)
2.07 (1.10,.21,.19,.19,.19,.19)
2.09
1.99
2.05

VP9
1.79x4 shots then trigger freeze
2.08
2.14
2.04
1.98

P07
2.28
2.05
1.97

Glock 19
1.99
1.95

Glock 34
1.90

SP01 Shadow
1.86
1.92
1.91
1.88

P30 LEM
2.37
2.12
2.09
2.11

Sig 229 SRT 9mm
2.15
2.09
2.06

Same 229 upper in DAK lower
2.73
2.47
2.48

Elite II Beretta
2.04
2.03

Colt 1911 Rail gun, 230 Blazer ball
2.13
2.07
2.05

[GJM]

Here are some subjective impressions.

Sig 320, when I missed it was low. It seems to point low. Trigger feels even in stock form, like it can be run fast.

VP9. I thought I would prefer the 320, but ended up liking the VP9 more. For gaming both the VP9 and 320 could use some trigger love.

P07, great shooter. I like polymer.

Glock 19. I have been shooting a Glock lately, so it felt comfortable. Sub 2 second Bill drills in a great size gun.

Glock 34, for gaming outperforms the 19 and 17 measurably, especially in the 15-30 yard range.

CZ SP01, great gaming gun. Easy to shoot trigger fast, cycles flat.

Sig 229 DA/SA surprised me how well it shot. May cycle faster than the 226 on close Bill type exercises.

Sig 229 DAK. Yep, folks are right it is harder to shoot fast.

P30 LEM, trigger feels LONG on Bill type drills. Have to work hard to shoot fast splits as my first run showed and then I really had to bear down. Like to try YVK's GG trigger magic.

Elite II, good shooter, but wished I tried thin slide Vertec to compare cycling.

Colt Rail 1911, haven't shot a 1911 more than a magazine or two in over five years, and can't recall a Bill drill. Kind of got into it -- see why Todd has 1911 love. Wish it weighed less and held more bb's.

[UNK]

Awesome stats and impressions. Thanks GJM

[JV_]

I may regret getting involved ... but I'm not seeing drastically different results. Excluding the DAK gun, the results are pretty close - including the LEM.

More time on the marginally slower guns could reduce the times.

[UNK]

The timer doesn't lie. It's a seven yard drill however. I am curious GJM How many rounds do you have on the 320 and the VP9

I may regret getting involved ... but I'm not seeing drastically different results. Excluding the DAK gun, the results are pretty close - including the LEM.

More time on the marginally slower guns could reduce the times.

[GJM]

The timer doesn't lie. It's a seven yard drill however. I am curious GJM How many rounds do you have on the 320 and the VP9

Approaching 500 with each of those pistols.

I may regret getting involved ... but I'm not seeing drastically different results. Excluding the DAK gun, the results are pretty close - including the LEM.

More time on the marginally slower guns could reduce the times.

The Glock 34 and SP01 outshoot everything else enough to matter if you game them. Otherwise pick the feature set you like and carry on. The DAK is definitely significantly slower on splits, and to get fast times on the LEM I have to push harder than with the others.

YVK has been working hard with his Gray P30 LEM, and I hope he shoots some Bills to add another data point with that custom trigger.

[UNK]

Do any pistols in your test have custom triggers?

Approaching 500 with each of those pistols.



The Glock 34 and SP01 outshoot everything else enough to matter if you game them. Otherwise pick the feature set you like and carry on. The DAK is definitely significantly slower on splits, and to get fast times on the LEM I have to push harder than with the others.

YVK has been working hard with his Gray P30 LEM, and I hope he shoots some Bills to add another data point with that custom trigger.

[98z28]

The Glock 34 and SP01 outshoot everything else enough to matter if you game them. Otherwise pick the feature set you like and carry on. The DAK is definitely significantly slower on splits, and to get fast times on the LEM I have to push harder than with the others.

I think we're done right here.

[YVK]

YVK has been working hard with his Gray P30 LEM, and I hope he shoots some Bills to add another data point with that custom trigger.

But u sez I need a new timer 'cause 0.14-0.16 splits with LEM are unpossible..

[Bill Wilson]

Missing info here. Type of holster? Impressive if a true carry holster? What target USPSA or IDPA? Are all these times "clean" runs? Only clean runs count.

I actually like my new Bill Drill II or 5x5 drill better:

Bill Drill II

Drill is to be shot using a true self-defense carry pistol and a proper concealment holster, NO competition gear allowed.

Start Position: Holstered Hands at Side or Ready Position as designated by range officer

Targets Required: 1 standard IDPA

Scoring: Limited Vickers Count, 15 rounds total

Distance: 7yds

String 1
On signal draw and engage target with 1 round

String 2
On signal draw and engage target with 2 rounds

String 3
On signal draw and engage target with 3 rounds

String 4
On signal draw and engage target with 4 rounds

String 5
On signal draw and engage target with 5 rounds


Holstered: Excellent 12 seconds or less, Very Good 14 seconds or less, Good 16 seconds or less

From the ready: Excellent 8 seconds or less, Very Good 9 seconds or less, Good 11 seconds or less

5x5 Skill Test


Designer: Bill Wilson

Purpose: Create a measurable quick to run and low round count skill drill that tests rapid fire pistol control.

Equipment: Service pistol of 9mm caliber or larger, concealed carry suitable holster and ammunition with a power factor of 125,000 or more.

Target: One standard IDPA, 10 yards downrange

Scoring: IDPA Limited Vickers, 25 shots total

Start Position: Hands at your sides facing target. No concealment garment necessary.

Procedure:

String 1: Draw and fire 5 shots freestyle

String 2: Draw and fire 5 shots strong hand only

String 3: Draw and fire 5 shots freestyle, reload from slidelock and fire 5 more shots freestyle

String 4: Draw and fire 4 shots to the body and 1 shot to the head freestyle

Skill ranking (Bill Wilson’s opinion)
Grand Master: 15 seconds or less
Master: 20 seconds or less
Expert: 25 seconds or less
Sharpshooter: 32 seconds or less
Marksman: 41 seconds or less
Novice: 50 seconds or less
Not proficient enough to carry a handgun: Over 50 seconds