Safety in IDPA Competition

[cclaxton]

Gentlemen and Ladies:
This is a great idea. I would hope that we try to keep this subforum focused on the positive. I want all shooting sports to be successful and to grow because shooting sports improves shooter safety and skills and mental discipline, and those are good things.

Since safety is the first thing we should always be concerned about with firearms, let's start with safety. As I have been a safety officer for over a year now, and Match Director I have noticed the area where most people need improvement is finger discipline. Too often I see people allow their trigger finger slip down into or close to the trigger guard. I would like to see that trigger finger up firmly on the side of the frame until the firearm is on target.

I have heard some people say that having the finger near the trigger guard is fine as long as it is not ON the trigger. But as the SO it is often difficult to observe and confirm. If the finger is on the frame, there is no question. Am I being too concerned about this?

Cody

[BJJ]

Not in my opinion.

[PPGMD]

1.2.5. Fingers must be outside the trigger guard during loading, unloading, drawing, reholstering, while moving (unless engaging targets) or during remedial action.

Seems pretty clear to me.

[jetfire]

Gentlemen and Ladies:
This is a great idea. I would hope that we try to keep this subforum focused on the positive. I want all shooting sports to be successful and to grow because shooting sports improves shooter safety and skills and mental discipline, and those are good things.

Since safety is the first thing we should always be concerned about with firearms, let's start with safety. As I have been a safety officer for over a year now, and Match Director I have noticed the area where most people need improvement is finger discipline. Too often I see people allow their trigger finger slip down into or close to the trigger guard. I would like to see that trigger finger up firmly on the side of the frame until the firearm is on target.

I have heard some people say that having the finger near the trigger guard is fine as long as it is not ON the trigger. But as the SO it is often difficult to observe and confirm. If the finger is on the frame, there is no question. Am I being too concerned about this?

Cody

Yes.

Is your finger out of the trigger guard? Y/N. If "Y", regardless of how some Marksman SO feels, you're fine.

[Mr_White]

I think it's really hard to judge whether a finger is inside or outside the trigger guard when it's not also required to be touching the frame or slide in a register position.

I don't personally think the rudimentary rule form of 'finger outside the trigger guard' is sufficient to address the problem of fingers applying pressure to a trigger without a conscious decision to fire having been made.

The customs in competitive shooting are pretty well established though, and I don't think you could make the change from 'outside the trigger guard' to 'proper register position' without vast shooter dissatisfaction.

[littlejerry]

Gentlemen and Ladies:
This is a great idea. I would hope that we try to keep this subforum focused on the positive. I want all shooting sports to be successful and to grow because shooting sports improves shooter safety and skills and mental discipline, and those are good things.

Since safety is the first thing we should always be concerned about with firearms, let's start with safety. As I have been a safety officer for over a year now, and Match Director I have noticed the area where most people need improvement is finger discipline. Too often I see people allow their trigger finger slip down into or close to the trigger guard. I would like to see that trigger finger up firmly on the side of the frame until the firearm is on target.

I have heard some people say that having the finger near the trigger guard is fine as long as it is not ON the trigger. But as the SO it is often difficult to observe and confirm. If the finger is on the frame, there is no question. Am I being too concerned about this?

Cody

"Near" the trigger guard is not the same as IN the trigger guard. Different guns and different hands may not allow finger placement where you would like to see it.

I advise you find a way to get over it.

[Wheeler]

I was a SO for about twelve years and didn't have an issue watching fingers regardless of position on the frame, slide, in front of, or under the trigger guard. My suggestion to novice SO's such as yourself is to learn to watch the gun first, then worry about watching feet, cover, and other sundry items that SO's have to keep track of. Use the ASO to watch the movement and cover violations and worry about the gun.

[Leroy]

Is finger on side of frame safer than on the side of trigger guard? I have always perceived this as an assumption rather than supported by evidence. What about reloading an HK?

[Mr_White]

Is finger on side of frame safer than on the side of trigger guard? I have always perceived this as an assumption rather than supported by evidence. What about reloading an HK?

I think it's safer, though I don't have anything handy to cite for you. It boils down to there being physiological reasons the digits can involuntarily contract - startle response, interlimb interaction, postural disturbance. The register position, with the finger outside and above trigger guard and pressed into frame or slide, is further from the finger getting onto the trigger than when the finger is outside the trigger guard but low and in line with the trigger.

Register position also gives a tactile reference point, which helps some people with trigger finger discipline in general. I think solely being outside the trigger guard is also more vulnerable to the problem of trigger checking. My opinion only though.

HKs are legit guns. I don't love their mag catch, though many people do. I don't love that it gives people a third thing to do with their trigger finger. It's even more elegantly simple for the finger to have exactly two tasks - be in register or work the trigger and shoot the gun. But I don't think it's a huge issue with HKs. It's more of a tiny annoyance from the trainer perspective, where in many instances it's harder to tell if a student is pressing the mag catch or putting their finger in an otherwise improper position. Similar to many instances in competitive shooting when trying to tell the difference between 'low and outside the trigger guard' and 'inside the trigger guard.'

[gringop]

"Near" the trigger guard is not the same as IN the trigger guard. Different guns and different hands may not allow finger placement where you would like to see it.

I advise you find a way to get over it.

If I, as an SO, don't see that your finger is completely out of the trigger guard unless you are firing at a target, I will call Finger. If I have to do it twice, you are DQed from the match. I'll get over that with no problems.