Lehigh Defense: Xtreme Penetrator Ammunition

[GJM]

Cross posted from USP thread:


I would like to throw an online version of a hissy fit.

So, I get my Gen 3 Glock 29SF running today, with Hornady Critical Duty. Marvel at how small it is to carry, and how easy to shoot, compared to the HK. Look at the penetration and velocity data for the Hornady 10mm load, and worry that it is closer to .40 S&W performance, than 10mm. Drag out the new stash of 2016 Federal Trophy Bonded 10mm, which while not crazy hot/heavy, is more like what one associates with 10mm. Three rounds into the first magazine of Trophy Bonded, I get a stoppage. Change magazines, fill with Trophy Bonded, and a few rounds into another magazine, get another stoppage. In disgust, I put down the Glock 29 and shoot 63 rounds of .45 Super and .acp through my USP 45, of course without issue. So the Glock 29 really seems to work well with .40 S&W power factor ammo.

[JHC]

Cross posted from USP thread:


I would like to throw an online version of a hissy fit.

So, I get my Gen 3 Glock 29SF running today, with Hornady Critical Duty. Marvel at how small it is to carry, and how easy to shoot, compared to the HK. Look at the penetration and velocity data for the Hornady 10mm load, and worry that it is closer to .40 S&W performance, than 10mm. Drag out the new stash of 2016 Federal Trophy Bonded 10mm, which while not crazy hot/heavy, is more like what one associates with 10mm. Three rounds into the first magazine of Trophy Bonded, I get a stoppage. Change magazines, fill with Trophy Bonded, and a few rounds into another magazine, get another stoppage. In disgust, I put down the Glock 29 and shoot 63 rounds of .45 Super and .acp through my USP 45, of course without issue. So the Glock 29 really seems to work well with .40 S&W power factor ammo.

Meanwhile the .40 CD matches the 10mm CD in even trimmer packages. I wonder if Lawman .40 uses a legit stout FMJ?

[Tamara]

So, I get my Gen 3 Glock 29SF running today, with Hornady Critical Duty. Marvel at how small it is to carry, and how easy to shoot, compared to the HK. Look at the penetration and velocity data for the Hornady 10mm load, and worry that it is closer to .40 S&W performance, than 10mm.

When I owned a Glock 29 I found that it would get the same or slightly greater velocities as the same company's equivalent .40 loads...if the .40 were fired from a Glock 24. Last 180gr XTPs I chronoed from my 20 were running 1100 and change, which is ~150fps north of pretty much any 180gr .40 load I can think of.

[GJM]

A friend sent me this link, referencing where noted bear guide Phil Shoemaker, stopped a brown bear on the AK Peninsula with a DAO S&W 9mm:

See Shoemaker stopping bear with 9mm!


http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthr...ics/11329740/4

tion: 9mm, 40 S&W, 45 ACP? [Re: bwinters]
458Win Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 2871
Loc: AK peninsula
In the past 33 years of living and guiding on the Alaska peninsula from our families homestead I have never had to kill a bear in defense of live or property. DLP as the state refers to it.
Two days ago I was guiding a married couple and we bumped into a bear at close range on our way to the fishing stream. We yelled and it ran but circled around and then charged. The couple were 10 or 12 feet behind me and the bear came out of the brush so close it was within 3 feet of my clients before I could shoot. They both intentionally fell to the ground just before I shot the bear behind the shoulder. It immediately spun and I continued shooting, all the while keeping the position of my clients in perspective. After six quick hits the bear turned and ran 20 yards and died .

We were planning on a quick couple hours of fishing and rather than packing my normal S&W 44 Mtn gun I was packing a S&W 3953 dao auto with 147 gr Buffalo Bore 9mm ammo.






Edited by 458Win (07/23/16)
_________________________
Phil Shoemaker - Alaska Master Guide
NRA Benefactor
Alaska Hunter Education Instructor
www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com

Anyone who claims the 30-06 is not effective has either not used one, or else is unwittingly commenting on their marksmanship.

[JHC]

A friend sent me this link, referencing where noted bear guide Phil Shoemaker, stopped a brown bear on the AK Peninsula with a DAO S&W 9mm:

See Shoemaker stopping bear with 9mm!


http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthr...ics/11329740/4

tion: 9mm, 40 S&W, 45 ACP? [Re: bwinters]
458Win Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 01/05/05
Posts: 2871
Loc: AK peninsula
In the past 33 years of living and guiding on the Alaska peninsula from our families homestead I have never had to kill a bear in defense of live or property. DLP as the state refers to it.
Two days ago I was guiding a married couple and we bumped into a bear at close range on our way to the fishing stream. We yelled and it ran but circled around and then charged. The couple were 10 or 12 feet behind me and the bear came out of the brush so close it was within 3 feet of my clients before I could shoot. They both intentionally fell to the ground just before I shot the bear behind the shoulder. It immediately spun and I continued shooting, all the while keeping the position of my clients in perspective. After six quick hits the bear turned and ran 20 yards and died .

We were planning on a quick couple hours of fishing and rather than packing my normal S&W 44 Mtn gun I was packing a S&W 3953 dao auto with 147 gr Buffalo Bore 9mm ammo.






Edited by 458Win (07/23/16)
_________________________
Phil Shoemaker - Alaska Master Guide
NRA Benefactor
Alaska Hunter Education Instructor
www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com

Anyone who claims the 30-06 is not effective has either not used one, or else is unwittingly commenting on their marksmanship.

Pretty cool. I wish he'd brained it too and proven the point about hard .355s

[GJM]

Phil Shoemaker is a renown Alaska bear guide, who has been hunting and living around bears for decades, and forgotten more than most know about bears. It is interesting that he offered this advice, and not long after, got to field test that advice!

"For protection from bears you don't want, or need, any expanding bullet. All you need is one you can shoot well and rapidly as you will need to poke a hole through the brain or CNS. Your 357 setup is perfectly suitable for that purpose. I know for a fact that it works on our much larger brown bears. If you prefer some brand of 9mm, Buffalo Bore makes a heavy, hard cast 147 gr bullet that gives 1100 fps from a 4" barrel and I personally wound not feel the least bit inadequate in grinning down any black bear with a magazine full of those."

[GJM]

More info here, on Buffalo Bore website:



Tim,

Two days ago I was guiding a couple from NY on a fishing trip and decided to pack my S&W 3954 pistol . When we were approaching the stream we bumped into a large boar who must have been sleeping as we were talking loud just so we wouldn't suprise one. Over the past 33 years I have lived and guided here on the Alaska peninsula I have never had to kill a bear in defense of life but this bear was different.

We were in thick brush and I was only 8 or 10 feet from the bear when he started growling and huffing. I began yelling and it eventually ran around, behind my two clients, into the brush. But within 15 seconds it came charging back from the area behind us and popped out of the brush 10 feet from me ! I had the little S&W in my hands and was thinking I was probably going to have to shoot it but as it cleared the brush it headed toward my clients. The man had enough sense to grab his wife and fall backwards into the tall grass. The bear seemed to loose track of them, even though it was less than 3 feet away from them and it was highly agitated ! It then swung toward me, I was 6 or 8 feet away, and I fired the first shot into the area between the head and shoulder. It growled and started wildly thrashing around, still basically on the feet of my clients. My next shot hit it in the shoulder and it began twisting and biting at the hits and I continued firing as fast as I could see vitals. Five shots later it turned into the brush and I hit it again and it twisted and fell 20 feet from us !

We hiked out and I flew back to camp to report the incident to F&G and pick up my daughter to go back and skin the bear for F&G.

You are the first person I have told this story to as I haven't decided whether to write it up or not, or where, but thought you should know that your ammo WORKS. We recovered 4 of the bullets and I took a photo of the back of the bear after the hide was removed that shows an entry on one side of the back and the tip of the bullet on the off side ...

Phil Shoemaker
www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com

[GJM]

Cross posted from USP thread:


I would like to throw an online version of a hissy fit.

So, I get my Gen 3 Glock 29SF running today, with Hornady Critical Duty. Marvel at how small it is to carry, and how easy to shoot, compared to the HK. Look at the penetration and velocity data for the Hornady 10mm load, and worry that it is closer to .40 S&W performance, than 10mm. Drag out the new stash of 2016 Federal Trophy Bonded 10mm, which while not crazy hot/heavy, is more like what one associates with 10mm. Three rounds into the first magazine of Trophy Bonded, I get a stoppage. Change magazines, fill with Trophy Bonded, and a few rounds into another magazine, get another stoppage. In disgust, I put down the Glock 29 and shoot 63 rounds of .45 Super and .acp through my USP 45, of course without issue. So the Glock 29 really seems to work well with .40 S&W power factor ammo.

This afternoon, I asked my wife to shoot what was left of the box of Trophy Bonded in her Glock 20 SF. First round, she had a stoppage, identical to what I was experiencing with the Glock 29. Federal must have done something with the load that has negatively effected reliability in Glock pistols. Wish I had a 1066/1076 here to test it.

[Chuck Haggard]

This afternoon, I asked my wife to shoot what was left of the box of Trophy Bonded in her Glock 20 SF. First round, she had a stoppage, identical to what I was experiencing with the Glock 29. Federal must have done something with the load that has negatively effected reliability in Glock pistols. Wish I had a 1066/1076 here to test it.

Fails to feed?

[GJM]

Fails to feed?

Yes, with the slide most of the way open.