Are we approaching group shooting the right way?

[Ptrlcop]

I think the NRA figured this out about 100 years ago with the timed and rapid fire stages of the traditional pistol match. It's easy to forget that the CMP had a primary function to raise the skills of shooters so that the skill would be there in a time of war.

5 rounds in 10 seconds at 25yds is a no shit test of skill with a pistola.


http://m.youtube.com/?reload=2&rdm=1...?v=lOecYp7NGgg

[okie john]

GJM.

For several years, I've been using one of Larry Vickers' trigger control drills in a manner similar to what you've shown here. He calls it "command fire" and it requires a timer. At whatever range you wish to conduct the drill (and it needs to be within a reasonable pistol range), you define a tight target zone and set the timer for 0.25 seconds. Line up sights, slack out trigger and on the beep fire a proper trigger controlled shot within the time constraint. It'll drive some folks nuts, but I've started using it on one handed shots and other "sickener" situations. It forces excellent trigger control in a real world time frame. LAV runs it at about 3-5 yards and requires hits INSIDE the x ring of the B-8 bull for a starter.

Give it a try and see what you think.

Thanks for posting this drill.

I shot it several times yesterday and today, but because I didn't read the original post carefully, I put the target at 25 yards instead of 3 to 5 yards.

First, I set up the timer and dry-fired several runs to get a feel for the 0.25-second par. Then I went live. I broke a few shots as quickly as 0.18-0.19, but most were from 0.20 to 0.30. A few were in the mid 0.4s, and a few went as long as 0.75. Oddly enough, the longer they took, the farther they tended to be from POA, although nothing left the 8 ring on this target. Shots that broke in 0.18 to 0.22 sec were nearly all touching. Shots that broke in 0.3 to 0.4 formed a group about 2" in diameter. Shots that took longer than 0.40 usually went out of the black.

Most of the runs had most hits in the black with a few out, like this:



Obviously, I heeled the one at twelve o'clock, and the three at six o'clock are from tightening my entire hand as the shot broke. There were a few pretty egregious trigger yanks that dropped shots out at the classic seven o'clock position on other targets, but again, none of them hit outside the 8 ring.

Then I shot this one again at 25 yards:



These shots all broke under 0.30 sec. The group was 3.625", with nine shots in 2.25". Had it not been for the flyer, this would have been one of my best 10-shot 25-yard groups ever, so I packed up my stuff and went home.

Learning has occurred, but I'm not entirely sure how to articulate it, so I'll ponder it and get back to you.

Thanks again to Wayne for posting this drill.


Okie John

[GJM]

In the last few days, it occurred to me that, for example, drawing to a two inch dot incorporates a draw, getting the pistol aligned, the slack taken out of the pistol, and then what Wayne was describing with his drill. The most important part being pressing the trigger straight back. I can't think of any kind of shooting from slow fire precision to Bill drills, and everything in-between, that wouldn't benefit by being to press the trigger straight back without disturbing the sights.

[Wayne Dobbs]

Glad to see you guys getting results from this drill. I run it at all kinds of distances, okie john, from four or five yards out to 50 yards. I use the same time interval no matter what the distance. It's the best drill I've seen for isolating the trigger press under a tight time constraint.