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Thread: Looks Like Legion Firearms is Shutting Down with No Rifles and No Refunds

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Haggard View Post
    This is why I caution a person, or more especially an agency, to stick to established gun makers.

    Our team just went and bought 8 pistol ARs (for an outrageous amount of money I might add) from a small maker because Piston!, if the maker goes under then they have guns with proprietary parts and no source to get things fixed.

    None of this counts if you have your gun needs met and you have the means to risk losing money on betting the small maker will not go under, in that case carry on.
    I'm aware of two local LE agency SRT teams in my area which have Legion rifles. The rifles themselves are great, accurate and reliable, though like Hodge defense, i think they are (were) over priced.

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  3. #13
    Site Supporter Chance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Cunningham View Post
    Best Carbine money can buy?

    If $2300 buys a carbine that doesn't exist, then a carbine I can put my hands on must be awfully expensive.

  4. #14
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    They don't do anything a Daniel Defense can't do at 1/2 the cost.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by VolGrad View Post
    ... don't even get me started on Tony. My blood pressure rose just seeing your reference to his debacle of a business.
    He seemed like a nice guy. Had dinner with him and everything. Then again, I was never all that great a judge of character (which is why I default to being untrusting).

    Quote Originally Posted by GardoneVT View Post
    The best customer service in the world won't fix cash flow problems.

    If your business can't create sellable product due to outside factors, its curtains unless the management can find a way to pay recurring expenses in the meantime.Legion firearms isn't the first business to fail that way, and won't be the last.
    Sure, CS is only one piece of the puzzle. However, I felt that if Legion hadn't of been so quiet on the comms, then there wouldn't be as many irate customers out for blood. This has nothing to do with whether or not Legion would have succeeded in the wake of the parts shortage, only that they would have gone out with an (relatively) untarnished reputation, which I think still matters quite a bit if the people that worked there want to have another go in the industry, whether it be with a new company or simply trying to get into another one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chance View Post
    Maybe it was just me, but I rarely had an issue getting a hold of them, and I probably called seven times over the past months. There were even times I called, got no response, only to have an unrecognized number call me back and it was Adam - I don't know if he saw it on the caller ID or what.
    I dunno, I personally used only email or else called Johnny Allen; the email responses were slow, but always got answered in detail. The phone calls were promptly returned if missed. However, there was a lot of bellyaching on Facebook, IIRC, about how phone calls were being ignored and full voicemail boxes. Who knows. I had a Helluva time getting in touch with Roy at Weapon Outfitters, yet everyone else I've talked to has said that WO is usually super-responsive. Luck of the draw, I guess.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chance View Post
    Oh, well. I'm a sucker. Lesson learned. Moving on.
    I wouldn't go so far as to call you a sucker. After all, all the recommendations were for the rifle... not the business plan. They were all super positive on the end product (and I've yet to hear any negative reports on the weapons themselves), but obviously that's not enough. And hey, a lot of people had to have been out on a limb when Noveske/BCM/LWRC/PWS/etc. first started building rifles. If anything, I guess the lesson is, buy only from established manufacturers that don't utilize proprietary parts?

  6. #16
    So what happened to all the money? They took in money but, couldn’t buy parts, didn’t pay shipping, and I presume didn’t pay employees to stand around doing nothing.

    My guess would be bankruptcy and people owed money will have to go through the courts.

  7. #17
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    Standard undercapitalized small business story.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by 5pins View Post
    So what happened to all the money? They took in money but, couldn’t buy parts, didn’t pay shipping, and I presume didn’t pay employees to stand around doing nothing.

    My guess would be bankruptcy and people owed money will have to go through the courts.
    Maybe, but my bet is that there isn't enough money to fund a bankruptcy. Instead, the deposits are probably long gone funding operating expenses and they will just close their doors and disappear. If they do go the bankruptcy route, expect a liquidation and pennies (if that) on the dollar. Companies like this usually keep running until the money is simply gone, and then fold and go away.

  9. #19
    Site Supporter Chance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeep View Post
    If they do go the bankruptcy route, expect a liquidation and pennies (if that) on the dollar.
    Yeah, but what are they going to have to liquidate? All of their parts were outsourced: MEGA made their receivers, STI made their pistols, et cetera. So some assembly tools and computers, maybe. They rent a small space in Temple (my family lives down the street, and I've driven by many times), so they don't even own the building.

    Someone on Facebook was doing some simple math: if they have 100 customers who spent at least $2000 (and I don't even think they offered something that cost less than $2000), you're easily approaching a quarter million, and that's just to your average joes. Who even knows what they owe to their suppliers, dealers, agencies....

  10. #20
    Site Supporter Tamara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TR675 View Post
    Standard undercapitalized small business story.
    Under-capitalized and over-committed. As common as dirt.

    We haven't seen the last of the failures spurred by the Great EBR Bubble of 2013, and (were I the betting type) bigger companies than this will take big hits before it's all said and done.

    It rained soup for a little bit there and some people, rather than sticking a bowl out the window, went deep in hock to lease swimming pools to catch it.

    ("Why doesn't Giant Ammo Co build a whole new factory to keep up with demand?" I heard a lot during the worst of it.)

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