I've had some luck with that with a 1911. Not sure about polymer frames. And idea on that?Originally Posted by mizer67
I've had some luck with that with a 1911. Not sure about polymer frames. And idea on that?
“Remember, being healthy is basically just dying as slowly as possible,” Ricky Gervais
I've had less success recently with a VP9 using that same technique. Good enough to shoot 2.0-2.5" groups, but not below that, with the stock sights. I know it's capable of more.
If I was really serious about chasing the best groups though I'd need to switch sights on most all of my guns, or run RMRs.
I use one of these - http://protektormodel.com/index.php?...&products_id=7 First saw it in a pic of test shooters at Wilson Combat. I place this bag on top of a piece of 4x4 to elevate my hands and pistol above the bench. I choose a chair that enables me to sit and lay both arms on the bench with elbows almost as fully extended as if shooting 2 hands standing - Isosceles, (had to look up spelling). The dust cover of the pistol is on the crotch of the bag. The bag is filled with sand but not packed real hard. The butt of the pistol is up off the bench. In my experience the mono pad, butt resting on bench technique, doesn't work so well as the gun really wants to bounce up and away from the bench. There is a definite learnable technique involved, that requires the usual staring at the front sight and really concentrating on the trigger - stuff we're supposed to do anyway, but the rest allows one to concentrate and see/feel movement, after a bit of practice. Everybody says "course my gun would do better in a ransom rest" But nobody has one. So thats a big assumption. A fellow Bullseye shooter (he's good - Im not) and I had access to a Ransom early this summer. After several trials, including new inserts we gave up. Bill Riehl who uses one successfully has explained there is a real technique to setting those up including custom molded inserts to the particular pistol being used. They are not the end all and be all. Actually makes sense when you think about as a one size, lowish priced mechanism, that can successfully control tiny movement in a myriad of pistols and revolvers would be an amazing invention. I also suspect that polymer framed pistols don't do so well in the Ransom as the frames are bendable and flexible. After struggling with the Ransom and not getting useable results. We knuckled down and really tried, concentrated, paid attention to the sandbag and evolved a technique thats kinda worked. have been able to get red dot sighted Bullseye 1911s to shoot 1" aggregates at 25 and a little over 2" at 50 yards. Have also formed an impression that the relationship of sights to the target is important. This seems counter intuitive as we're told not to look at the target. But I think with the rest, with care, you can - not without impunity, but with care.... The red dot sight - ours are 3.5s, a black bullseye, (NRA B6) and a good pair of glasses really helps. Have not been able to repeat those groups (with guns guaranteed to shoot 1" @25, etc) but set up with iron sights - even with Dr. Wong's magical iron sight shooting glasses. Im an old fart. I notice to, that after shooting 5 or 6 groups testing a pistol/load combo and really concentrating, that when I stand up and shoot 2 handed off hand with the same combo, I get better groups, then if I just started shooting standing cold. This of course works till my brain wakes up and starts reacting to recoil, noise, muzzle flash....
Instead of a bench try using a set of shooting sticks. (Crossed sticks) you can make a cheap set for a few bucks. I shoot my .44 's and all our single shot pistols better off the sticks then the bench. I pti the sticks about mid front grip in the contenders. And as close to the cylinders on the revolvers. Many white tail deer didn't like that combo.
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Hmm, that's interesting. Have you ever shot a semi-auto this way?
Thanks for the responses thus far! I'm going to try some of the above techniques this Sunday. Some of you are turning in serious groups! JHC that group with the 17, flier and all, is VERY impressive. So is that 6" group @ 100 Malamute. I'm gonna bring several NRA B8s and try different techniques with my Gen 3 17 and Speer 124+Ps. If I can't get good groups using the above techniques I'll probably order that $26 rest and give it a go, and/or try shooting sticks.
I'm also having trouble getting good groups from the bench. I think my problem is that the bench on our range is too low in relation to the height of the stools, which forces me to look through the top of my glasses, which keeps me from seeing the sights clearly. I'm going shooting tomorrow, so I'll experiment with different setups and let you know how it goes.
Okie John
John, what you just said makes sense. I hadn't thought of it in relation to pistol shooting before though. In bench shooting rifles, many complain about the kick of more powerful rifles, but the way most people do it, they are too low and leaned way into it. Being able to sit with your back straight or nearly so helps in recoil management. It should help with pistol shooting also, in regards to a comfortable position as well as looking through the best part of your glasses (I don't wear glasses). When shooting off the hood of my truck, I'm not leaning much, and its pretty comfortable with a rest on the hood.
Absolutely a problem. Some of this is trial and error. And its all personal, relative to your body size/height/arm length, eyesight and the bench setup - including chair height, stability and orientation. If I have multiple bulls on one target, Ill even go so far as to orient the sandbag, so that my arms and head are straight onto each bull. Holding your head in one place (comfortably) is a plus. I have an extreme astigmatism, so my issues may be different than some, but moving the head induces a kind of parallax error. Looking through the center of my lens is critical.
Your points on vision is a big deal. Using monovision contact prescriptions the bullseye in this exercise is getting fuzzier and fuzzier while the front sight remains sharp. RDS is somewhere in my future.
AFAIK a black bullseye for a 6:00 hold is pretty much optimal for checking groups although holding 6:00 on a 3x5 has worked pretty well too. I'm not sure if it's just anecdotal because I haven't tried this that many times side by side with a B8 but I've had some inkling that the smaller rimfire rifle bullseyes give a pretty precise target to hold 6:00 on.
“Remember, being healthy is basically just dying as slowly as possible,” Ricky Gervais
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