The .38 Special is relevant to me. When I'm not carrying a 1911 I carry a revolver loaded with 158gr LSWCHP+P ammunition -- which others in the thread have mentioned as well. I normally use the Remington version but I'd like to try the Buffalo Bore offering in my guns.
A full-size revolver loaded with .38+P IMO offers a good balance of power and low recoil/flash/bang.
.35 cal bullets are .35 cal bullets, regardless of which cartridge is used to launch them. On the other hand, quantity as a quality all of its own, as I previously wrote about: http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.p...w-quot-J-frame. I'll take 15 rds of 9 mm over 5-6 rds of .38 Sp/.357 Mag any day of the week. On a shot for shot basis, the 9 mm 147 gr works as well or better than the .38 sp 158 gr +P.
Gold Dots have periodically been improved over time.
Facts matter...Feelings Can Lie
Ref Gold Dots, I know the 124gr bullet has been improved at least once since it was introduced due to our involvement with Speer after a few OISs we had where penetration fell under the catagory of "P for plenty".
My comment was based on my general experience shooting and handloading both cartridges. I should have said, "The cartridge does everything the 9mm can do, plus a little, but not enough to choose one over the other based purely on the cartridge itself."Originally Posted by Haraise
I apologize for my role in driving this thread off topic.
Okie John
Very relevant, especially in small revolvers. I've yet to find a 9mm semi-auto that could replace my 642/442 for pocket carry.
Ken
Agreed
To me, that's where the .38 shines in modern times. It's a niche role, but nothing I've found fills it quite as well.
I'm one of those folks who is completely under whelmed by today's so called +P offerings. I remember back in the early to mid 1970s a cop I knew who carried a M-14 as his duty gun bought reload practice ammo in 2000 round lots. He always chronographed to see that it was as ordered performance wise. I watched him testing some before a combat match and it was averaging right around 850 fps from his 6" barrel. He ran six rounds through a 4" and it came out a little over 800 fps. The load was 3.5g-3.7g (don't remember exactly) of Bullseye behind a 158g RNL projectile.
Last year a friend who's an ICOR competitor and carries a revolver daily, asked me to chrono some Rem +P 158g SWC-HP. In a 4" S&W chambered for the 38 Special it averaged 807 fps. Sounds exactly like that old cops practice hand load back in the day. And since when is a 125g or 135g bullet @ 925 fps a barn burner?
Sorry all you fans of +P but I remain completely under whelmed. The glaring exception to this is the Buffalo Bore 38 Special +P 158g SWCHP-GC, which duplicates the old 38-44 round from 1930. (smiley face goes here)
Dave
It's 2014 not 1970. Bullet design's come a long way baby.
Velocity ain't all its cracked up to be anymore.
But if you feel the need, the need for some speed... the Wilson Combat XPB+P 110gr. clock in at 1050fps from a 4".
You get a modern bullet and velocity!
It's like magic.
Last edited by JodyH; 06-29-2014 at 12:00 AM.
"For a moment he felt good about this. A moment or two later he felt bad about feeling good about it. Then he felt good about feeling bad about feeling good about it and, satisfied, drove on into the night."
-- Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy --
I agree with Jody that velocity isn't all its cracked up to be.
In the case of the Remington +P and Federal +P LHPs for instance, you'll find the velocity difference between the two to be about 100 FPS, with the Federal round being faster. The reason for this appears to be the hardness/softness of the lead. Remington's LHPs are quite soft (able to be deformed if dropped on a hard surface from just 6 inches above it, in my experience), as a result they don't need to be driven fast to expand reliably. In fact quite the opposite, if you drive them really fast (up around 1000 FPS), they tend to come apart, without penetrating effectively. By contrast Federal used a harder lead that doesn't deform as easily and needs to be driven faster to reliably expand. It's the same story with the Buffalo Bore bullets. I haven't had this confirmed, but I suspect BB uses two different 158-grain LSWCHPs in their two different loads, the standard pressure (for older snubs) appears to be softer lead than the +P loads I currently have stocked.
I really like the Barnes bullets, but don't like what light fast bullets do to forcing cones and I don't like that they don't hit with factory fixed sights in the way 147-158 grain bullets do.
-Rob
Reply With Quote