SHO AIWB draw technique?

[jetfire]

It may be my imagination, but I'm pretty sure Rob lasered his hand with a hot gun multiple times during his demo.

It's hard to tell with 2D video, it could have gone either way. I'll give him a pass on this one.

[Mr_White]

I like the method of getting my strong hand thumb in contact with the outside of my thigh, using the thumb to lift the shirt, but otherwise ignoring the shirt and going straight to master grip and the rest of the draw. I started doing that based on a written description TLG put on TPI a few years ago, tried it, and it worked pretty well. It's definitely a lot better starting with the hands below the hemline of the shirt, as with a hands relaxed at sides start. There is much more disaster factor when the hands start higher and the strong hand has a better opportunity to short-stroke the motion and not get a hold of the shirt.

[MVS]

I like the method of getting my strong hand thumb in contact with the outside of my thigh, using the thumb to lift the shirt, but otherwise ignoring the shirt and going straight to master grip and the rest of the draw. I started doing that based on a written description TLG put on TPI a few years ago, tried it, and it worked pretty well. It's definitely a lot better starting with the hands below the hemline of the shirt, as with a hands relaxed at sides start. There is much more disaster factor when the hands start higher and the strong hand has a better opportunity to short-stroke the motion and not get a hold of the shirt.

Interesting. I have been shown a draw starting the strong hand around the off side thigh and bringing the thumb under the hem then moving up and over. The problem I find with that and potentially your method is that it is very dependent on how your shirt lies. If your waist sticks out past your buckle it seems to leave an opening at the hem level that is easy to move a thumb into. My shirt doesn't lie that way so anything other than outright grabbing the hem and pulling up seems very hit and miss for me.

[AtomicToaster]

Interesting. I have been shown a draw starting the strong hand around the off side thigh and bringing the thumb under the hem then moving up and over. The problem I find with that and potentially your method is that it is very dependent on how your shirt lies. If your waist sticks out past your buckle it seems to leave an opening at the hem level that is easy to move a thumb into. My shirt doesn't lie that way so anything other than outright grabbing the hem and pulling up seems very hit and miss for me.

Likewise; most of my shirts sit against my belt line. It has a tendency to foul any draw that depends on getting under the hem of the shirt. I'll play around with Origami's method a bit, though. The method outlined by Gomez seems to be more reliable at this point.

As an aside, shirts of heavier material and of a cut that hangs forward of the belt are a bit easier to work with.

[TheTrevor]

I like the method of getting my strong hand thumb in contact with the outside of my thigh, using the thumb to lift the shirt, but otherwise ignoring the shirt and going straight to master grip and the rest of the draw. I started doing that based on a written description TLG put on TPI a few years ago, tried it, and it worked pretty well. It's definitely a lot better starting with the hands below the hemline of the shirt, as with a hands relaxed at sides start.

That sounds like an improvement over my diagonal-upward thumb swipe from the centerline. I'll have to give that a try tonight.

For some reason, I thought I'd previously seen vids of you pulling your shirt very high up and clear before driving onto the gun. Do you only do that during a two-handed freestyle draw, or is it something you used to do but have since eliminated in SHO draws?

There is much more disaster factor when the hands start higher and the strong hand has a better opportunity to short-stroke the motion and not get a hold of the shirt.

Ain't that the truth. I've noticed in video that my shirt seems to stay put predictably when my hand starts below the hem line, but if I have to drive my hand down and then come up to clear the shirt it's moving all over the place. (YMMV for different styles of shirt, of course.) I see a significantly higher failure rate on AIWB SHO draws if I'm starting with my hands in interview or surrender position, to the point that I have to remind myself to slow down a bit (i.e. add an extra tenth or two) on the first part of the draw to get good results.

[Mr_White]

I have been shown what was described to me as the Vinh SHO draw. If I am describing it accurately, it was to reach down to the hem of the shirt at centerline, lift the shirt with a claw grip and bring the strong hand outward and onto the master grip. The wrist tends to trap the shirt material against the abdomen allowing an unobstructed master grip.

I think that's a good way, but I prefer mine (for me.) And again, this is assuming I correctly understand the Vinh technique. The strong hand lifting my shirt from centerline is less reliable for me than the method I use, because the lift gets a little obstructed by my belt buckle and holster. Nothing is in the way between the outside of my thigh and the grip.

Interesting. I have been shown a draw starting the strong hand around the off side thigh and bringing the thumb under the hem then moving up and over. The problem I find with that and potentially your method is that it is very dependent on how your shirt lies. If your waist sticks out past your buckle it seems to leave an opening at the hem level that is easy to move a thumb into. My shirt doesn't lie that way so anything other than outright grabbing the hem and pulling up seems very hit and miss for me.

Likewise; most of my shirts sit against my belt line. It has a tendency to foul any draw that depends on getting under the hem of the shirt. I'll play around with Origami's method a bit, though. The method outlined by Gomez seems to be more reliable at this point.

As an aside, shirts of heavier material and of a cut that hangs forward of the belt are a bit easier to work with.

That's a very valid point - how the shirt lies. If I wore significantly different shirts than I do, I might want to revisit some techniques and see if they needed reworking. I don't personally run into a problem clearing my shirt the way I described, but a key to doing that reliably is to stab my thumb into my thigh. If I don't make very definite contact between thumb and thigh, it is easy to miss the garment.

For some reason, I thought I'd previously seen vids of you pulling your shirt very high up and clear before driving onto the gun. Do you only do that during a two-handed freestyle draw, or is it something you used to do but have since eliminated in SHO draws?

I really prefer not to drag the shirt way above the gun and then dive my hand down onto the grip. There was a match video where I did that and TLG was asking me about it somewhere on here. In that case it had to do with a weirdo start position if I remember right. Not the way I normally try to do it.

I see a significantly higher failure rate on AIWB SHO draws if I'm starting with my hands in interview or surrender position

Same for me. I think it's an inherent disadvantage to that combination of a hands-high start position, SHO draw, and a closed-front shirt. Doesn't mean it can't be made to work well, but I think it will always be more difficult and/or higher risk.

The required hands-high-torso start position at Rogers gave me a lot of potential for costly mistakes on SHO draws. My method was still able to help me get done what I was able to get done though. The lost point on Friday was directly attributable to that exact mistake (missed the shirt.) Of course, the flipside is to consider how many points it helped me accumulate apart from that one mistake. I think it served me well overall.

[BoppaBear]

I use my strong hand thumb. Go below my shirt, just behind the butt of the pistol, and lift the cover garment with the thumb while getting the master grip. I guess the motion is a bit of a tight, back to front arch to the grip.

The biggest problem I have had is the potential to make contact between thumb and belt while trying to lift the shirt, which will obviously disrupt the draw stroke.

[BobLoblaw]

Mere pleb here.

When it comes to lighter shirts (t shirts, button-ups, polos, etc.), I grab a wad of fabric under my strong side bottom rib area and the light friction from my arm (when driving it down toward the holster) holds the shirt in place. Reason being is that I've run into trouble on the two-handed draw with snagging my strong side thumb on the hem when rushing to the master grip and this gives some consistency whether you grab that part of the shirt with your left or right hand. The bunched fabric is already above your draw hand so there's nothing to snag.

Obviously, longer shirts would make this more difficult.