Thanks. I was looking at the groups thinking "If 'Freestyle' means one-handed I have a LOOOOoooong" way to go."Originally Posted by JMS
Thanks. I was looking at the groups thinking "If 'Freestyle' means one-handed I have a LOOOOoooong" way to go."
"You're only young once, but you can be immature forever" Ogden Nash
"We have met the enemy, and he is us." Pogo
So today my first group of 5 was like this:
I'm okay with the flier and the fact that I must've held too high, but then.....
Everything is shifting left. 20 rounds about 3 inches left. I was only shooting High Country reman, so maybe as the weather heated things like me up, I just got worse, but damn I'm consistent a bit left.
Judging by the first group, I'd have to say the sights must be pretty on, but if I'm that consistently left by a few inches, where should I start?
Ammo?
Bench rest?
Sight drift?
I'm guessing bench it with the same ammo, then change the ammo and lastly sights?
Just to add a twist, I did 5 shots at the end of my session WHO (left for me) at the head box of the Q bottle and I got this:
A pretty good group for me WHO freestyle.
Fire away tutors.
FYI: for those new to my journey, the gun is a P30 LEM in 9mm.
Fairness leads to extinction much faster than harsh parameters.
Where was the Sun? (Assuming you shot outdoors). The Sun at 3:00 or 9:00 can change your perception of the sight alignment.
If ambient light isn't a factor and since you shot left both offhand and WHO how do your sights look relative to the center line of your slide? Was the POA/POI better in previous range sessions?
Another thought. I have had sunglasses alter my POI. I shoot with clear Oakley lenses only now. During a class when were were shooting Bulls at 25 yards I switched out my Oakley clear lenses to a VR28 lenses and I shot high until I switched my lenses back to clear.
Last edited by JohnO; 07-08-2014 at 06:19 PM.
This is where it gets really complicated and I'm glad you brought this up.
1. We shot from 2-3pm.
2. The sun was hitting the target, but I'm under a covered shed where even with back-lighting I can't always see my Hi-Viz HD night sights. It's almost like shooting in low light.
3. The rear sight has recently been drifted right as close to .019 of an inch by an armorer to compensate for the left POI.
My POA is about 2/3rds up the card. Often times I'm getting damn near perfect vertical, but you can see the horizontal is consistently off about 3-4 inches. Of course I presume this could also be ammo inconsistency?
TIA for the feedback.
Fairness leads to extinction much faster than harsh parameters.
Before you do any or anymore sight adjustments I would try a few things.
1. Take a piece of plain white paper and use a fat Sharpie and a ruler to bisect it vertically and horizontally. (make a bunch). Aim for the intersection but really focus on aligning with the vertical line. See where your shots are impacting.
Here is a target you can print try at increasing distances and see where your POI is. As well you can run these drills. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Azb3q8wOrV4
http://haleystrategic.com/downloads/...get_stripe.pdf
2. Test a few different types of ammo to check for problems related to the ammo you are using.
3. Have someone else shoot your gun. See if it is doing the same thing for them.
4. Take a hard look at the front sight. Make sure it is centered and parallel with the slide & bore axis.
Thanks. I've seen that video and know those targets, but haven't tried them.
Fairness leads to extinction much faster than harsh parameters.
1) I would try some different ammo to eliminate that as a variable.
2) I would try to eliminate sun angle by shooting at a different time or on a cloudy day.
3) I would focus on finishing "flat" with your press, per Ron Avery.
4) I would look at front and rear sights to see if they are centered.
5) Think back to other pistols, and whether you need a sight deflection. I, for example, need a right rear sight deflection on all handguns, and a left rear deflection on all rifles. It has been that way for over 25 years, so I just zero all sights to my eyes, starting with a slight drift right, and then test firing at 25 and 50 yards.
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
My only suggestion would be to try a bore-sight, and see where the sights are in relation to the barrel alignment. Then adjust your aim to suit...
"You're only young once, but you can be immature forever" Ogden Nash
"We have met the enemy, and he is us." Pogo
Thanks. Here's a sit rep on those points so far.
1. I have and that's a few pages back and before I drifted the rear sight a tad right.
2. I will.
3. I haven't read his book, but does that mean finish with the sights flat on follow through and the trigger flat against the frame?
4. They look ok. I'll take a picture. I have no pusher or caliper.
5. Previous pistols had stock sights and I wasn't as good at shooting as I think I am now.
I'll keep you all posted.
Fairness leads to extinction much faster than harsh parameters.
Thank you. I am always amazed by folks who zero their scopes in a rest or vice, then go hunting and wonder why they can't hit anything. My shooting coach at school wouldn't even let us use sandbags for sighting shots because, as he said, "Everyone pulls the trigger differently, and it shows on the target."
"You're only young once, but you can be immature forever" Ogden Nash
"We have met the enemy, and he is us." Pogo
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