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Thread: Freestyle shooting at 25 yds revisited

  1. #121
    Looks good ash

  2. #122
    Member BaiHu's Avatar
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    Since my range is only allowing 25 yd shooting for reasons not worthy of discussion, here are my problems Drs of PF.

    I shot with my dad yesterday at 25 yds and it was abysmal. I cannot bench rest. I'm too short, so chairs suck and the rests are too high given the trajectory of the 25 yd mark on the range. Needless to say, I feel better and more consistent with freestyle. However, I did notice whether standing, sitting, hanging upside down like a monkey or adjusting my trigger finger placement, I was consistently shooting a bit left. If anyone sees this as a trigger finger problem and not a sight problem, please tell me. If that's impossible, then I understand.

    All shots were made standing, slow, with occasional grip or 'relaxation' adjustments between 5 shots. Each set of 5 shots were done within 45 seconds. All shots were made with a P30 in 9mm LEM with HD Trijicon sights under the cover of a roof and out into the open 86* and humid NJ summer heat. POA was cover the 1 inch square on all 20 shots. With any luck, I will clean the gun (it's been a bit over 2k) and try this again tomorrow and see if I shoot any closer to the center line.

    All the masking tape was used to cover up all shots made by previous shooters on this cardboard. Any 'shots' not accounted for were pellet or 22 shots that I just ignored due to the obvious size difference.

    The Ammo Types in order of bottom to top.


    The target was a 5" PF target I had in my bag.








    Disappearing Shot Trick. I could not find that 5th shot. Shots are in red/black lines.




    My 'key'


    My amateur conclusion is that there is a great cluster to the left by about 4-5" from the middle and other than a flier or so, it doesn't smack of a typical right handed 'jerk' down and too the left. I've moved my finger a bit deeper into the 'crook' or closer to the tip and nothing seems to change that consistent 'port' side impact. I'm starting to think that the sight needs to be drifted a teensy weensy bit to the left, correct??
    Last edited by BaiHu; 06-29-2014 at 04:15 PM.
    Fairness leads to extinction much faster than harsh parameters.

  3. #123
    Site Supporter Failure2Stop's Avatar
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    Trying to use a 1" square at 25 yds is setting yourself up for failure.

    I'd highly recommend a more conducive target before making conclusions.
    Director Of Sales
    Knight's Armament Company

  4. #124
    Member TheTrevor's Avatar
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    As I think you know, I was surprised to find my P30 shooting significantly left at 15-20+ yds with the sights aligned to the center rib. While I agree with F2S regarding an appropriate target, I'm perfectly willing to believe a sight adjustment is needed.
    Looking for a gun blog with AARs, gear reviews, and the occasional random tangent written by a hardcore geek? trevoronthetrigger.wordpress.com/
    Latest post: The Rogers Shooting School Experience (15 Jul 2014)

  5. #125
    Member BaiHu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failure2Stop View Post
    Trying to use a 1" square at 25 yds is setting yourself up for failure.

    I'd highly recommend a more conducive target before making conclusions.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTrevor View Post
    As I think you know, I was surprised to find my P30 shooting significantly left at 15-20+ yds with the sights aligned to the center rib. While I agree with F2S regarding an appropriate target, I'm perfectly willing to believe a sight adjustment is needed.
    I agree with both of you.

    Here's the 'hink'. Not too long ago, I found that me and 3 other shooters were shooting this particular P30 left as close as 3 yds. I had them drifted and everything was POA/POI. However, all of that shooting was indoor this winter and late spring in a 15 yd max range....Now, I'm out in the sun at 25 yds and it seems to be creeping. Perhaps the adjustment was fine up to 15 yds, but at 25 yds it just needs a tiny push.

    While I'm spit-balling here, I was re-reading this thread and I was curious as to what you guys like to shoot at 25 yds? A standard B8? A PF target with a horizontal crossed by a vertical line?

    TIA
    Fairness leads to extinction much faster than harsh parameters.

  6. #126
    Member TheTrevor's Avatar
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    B-8, B-16, B-38 all acceptable. If I'm planning in advance to procure an ideal target, I like a dark or black spray painted cardboard backer with these:

    https://www.birchwoodcasey.com/Targe...ye-Target.aspx

    That said, I would look to folks who do serious pistol work at 25+ yards for better recommendations.
    Looking for a gun blog with AARs, gear reviews, and the occasional random tangent written by a hardcore geek? trevoronthetrigger.wordpress.com/
    Latest post: The Rogers Shooting School Experience (15 Jul 2014)

  7. #127
    Member hossb7's Avatar
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    So I went out again with my M&P and G19.

    I have zero confidence in Freedom Munition and will not be buying anymore.

    Here is 115gr, 124gr and 147gr with my M&P:



    (i wrote 125gr on the target, but it's 124gr) and yes, that's about 2.5' of vertical spread. pretty shit.





    And my Gen4 Glock 19:








    Then I switched ammo to Federal AE9DP:



    Two targets with the Glock (to confirm that it's shooting left):





    And one with my P226 for good measure:

    If not me, then who?

  8. #128
    Member hossb7's Avatar
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    All in all it was good. I was very surprised how much ammo makes a difference - even FMJ/range ammo.

    If not me, then who?

  9. #129
    I have noticed a few things about shooting at 25 recently.

    1) If you have any deficiencies, it will help bring them out where they might be covered-up at closer ranges.

    2) I was killing myself because the round was not impacting where the front sight indicated the point of impact should be. IT'S THE CHEAP AMMO STUPID!!!

    3) Winchester White Box is more accurate than I would have predicted.

    4) The world changes past 15 yards.

    5) NEVER CHANGE MORE THAN ONE THING AT A TIME WHEN YOU ARE TRYING TO ISOLATE YOUR ISSUES, I.E., GRIP, AMOUNT OF FINGER IN TRIGGER, ETC...

  10. #130
    Site Supporter Failure2Stop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaiHu View Post
    I agree with both of you.

    Here's the 'hink'. Not too long ago, I found that me and 3 other shooters were shooting this particular P30 left as close as 3 yds. I had them drifted and everything was POA/POI. However, all of that shooting was indoor this winter and late spring in a 15 yd max range....Now, I'm out in the sun at 25 yds and it seems to be creeping. Perhaps the adjustment was fine up to 15 yds, but at 25 yds it just needs a tiny push.

    While I'm spit-balling here, I was re-reading this thread and I was curious as to what you guys like to shoot at 25 yds? A standard B8? A PF target with a horizontal crossed by a vertical line?

    TIA
    I like 3x5 cards, and B8 targets.
    What I want in the target is something that is uniform, identifiable, and offers a distinct hold-point when focusing on the front sight edge.
    I do not want to be looking for little red/white/grey dots while I'm supposed to be focusing on the front sight.
    If lateral placement is the question, use a target that is close to the width of the front sight (again, while focusing on the front sight), and don't overly worry about vertical hold.

    Don't get wrapped around trying to hold/hit the center of the target. All you need is a good, easily referenced, consistent point on which to hold your sights.

    ETA: I would agree with a right drift of your sights.
    Director Of Sales
    Knight's Armament Company

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