Are HK mags stainless?

[ToddG]

Aha, now there's a rabbit hole to go down. The SOCOM OHWS candidates. HK beefed up their design for that specific tender, instead of going thinner/lighter. Must've been for a reason, however ridiculous the requirements set forth by SOCOM were. Or maybe it was just a bunch of drunk Germans celebrating Oktoberfest at Oberndorf and they placed bets on who could weld the biggest slabs of steel onto the slide before they passed out. In any case, the apparently worse engineered pistol won for better performance.

Shootability was not a part of that test, neither was there a size/weight restriction. But there were a number of other requirements and HK apparently went with a huge, heavy gun to meet those requirements.

You may note that when they started again for a pistol that was going to be tested differently (by a unit known for its handgun skills and used to shooting 1911s, in fact) that they made the gun a lot lighter, especially in the slide.

But they still stuck with the basic USP/P2000 design because they haven't created a gun out of whole cloth since the USP40 in what, '93?

[BaiHu]

I don't know diddly about guns other than the 4 rules and how to do a FAST under 7 seconds, but I do know a bit about people and how businesses work.

1. Egos rule peoples' brains and egos tend to outrun people's intelligence, wallets, strength, etc.
2. Businesses are run by people.

That short socioeconomic lesson can be applied to this whole thread with the following example:

We, at Brand X Gun Co. sell guns that people like enough that we're making a profit. In order to continue making a profit, increase margins and expand our user base, we have to a) support the current firearms we've already sold (costs money), b) make something different every year (costs money) or c) pretend like we made something different, but what we really did was take something old and put a different skirt, wig and shoes on it (which costs less money). Ideally, if you can steal, borrow or copy, then you spend less on R&D (which costs the most amount of money AND requires testing ). Once you get a chance to ride success, most people/companies just ride it right into the ground until they absolutely have to change or they'll be losing money/market share/out of business. Or at least that's what I've learned hanging around humans and dead presidents

[GJM]

But they still suck with the basic USP/P2000 design because they haven't created a gun out of whole cloth since the USP40 in what, '93?

FIFY

Kidding aside, I hope HK hits it out of the park with their new striker, which I hope will be accurate, reliable, ergonomic and have a trigger option to die for.

[Magic_Salad0892]

FIFY

Kidding aside, I hope HK hits it out of the park with their new striker, which I hope will be accurate, reliable, ergonomic and have a trigger option to die for.

I loved striker guns for a long time. HK never released one. I get interested in hammer fired guns, and HK releases a striker gun.

Lol.

[TCinVA]

But they still stuck with the basic USP/P2000 design because they haven't created a gun out of whole cloth since the USP40 in what, '93?

...and it's worth pointing out that businesses across industries frequently tweak existing designs rather than go through the often arduous (and expensive) process of designing a product from a blank sheet to be as good as it possibly can be. Whether we're talking cars, software, or pacemakers when you have something that works well enough already (defined by market success, customer feedback, etc) there's a built in disincentive to throw it all out and start again.

It's also probably worth noting that H&K has spent a lot of money on doing radically different designs over the years, and has been bitten in the buttocks in the process. Perhaps because of things like the G11 or watching the P7 family of pistols (H&K's most successful handgun prior to the USP, I believe) sort of flounder there's an institutional reticence to try blank-sheet designs unless compelled to by outside forces.

The USP and derivative pistols have not been as prolific in the market as Glocks, but by H&K handgun standards they've been wildly successful.

Returning to the original topic of the thread, Bill:

What features of the P30 magazine lead you to hold it in such high regard?