(Note: This is an excellent forum, and pistol-training.com is one of my favorite sites both for information and pleasure. Thank you to all who maintain and contribute. It's good community service.)
I’ve often perused this forum for information, guidance, or just pleasure reading. I’ve never posed a question because I’ve always been able to find suitable data by reading through the various threads on this forum (and others) or by consulting a friend or colleague.
Now, however, I do have a question that is specific enough to my personal circumstances that I have not been able to find a thread directly on point—although I have read various posts that come close—and have no friends or colleagues with actual experience on the matter.
A bit of background:
I intend to have a go at AIWB carry. AIWB never interested me in the past because I have a carry system that works well for me and that I’ve diligently trained with. In about four-to-six months, however, I’m going to start working in an environment where it’s imperative that my armed state remain private. The issue is not legality or policy; it’s a matter of perception/career. I have carried in low profile situations before without issue and, in any event, consider the ‘concealed’ part of ‘concealed carry’ of great import regardless of the circumstances. The difference now is that I will have clothing and appearance restrictions that leave AIWB as my only option for carrying a moderately compact or full-sized duty weapon with the utmost discretion.
I have read the entire “AIWB (Appendix Carry)” thread and the “AIWB holsters, a pictorial guide” thread (as well as many other threads). I’ve also read blog posts on point by Mr. Green in pistol-training.com’s archives. I am grateful for the information.
After much consideration, I’ve decided that I would prefer to use a pistol that is DA/SA and has a manual safety/decocker. In our present day, that leaves me few options. I’ve decided on either the HK USP Compact V1 or the Beretta M9A1 Compact.
I have a good understanding of the interworkings of the various striker-fired designs, DA/SA Decocker only designs, 1911s, other SA designs, LEMs, DAKs, etc. I do not consider it unsafe or unwise for a well-trained and careful person to carry such designs AIWB.
In point of fact, my present primary personal carry weapon is a Glock and has been for years. Like many, I’m a Glock certified armorer. I have a large stable of Glocks and spare Glock parts. I’m also mechanically inclined and have an armorer’s understanding and ability with many other designs. I also own many other designs. I have also carried a 1911 regularly and other SA only designs.
I’ve had formal pistol training and continue to train diligently and regularly. During one of my Grad School programs, I was employed part-time in a field that required plain-clothes concealed carry, training, and travel. I have also competed; though as of late my professional responsibilities have not allowed it.
All that just to say, gently and respectfully, that I’m not seeking, nor do I presently require, counsel on handgun design, safety, training, etc. I am certainly not an expert in design, safety, training, carry, etc.; I am, however, a well-informed generalist with a practitioner’s understanding. I’m careful, deliberate, and responsible. I will not train live AIWB until I’ve borne countless dry training exercises with my chosen weapon. I will then not carry live until I’ve engage in extensive live fire training with my chosen weapon. In short, I will not carry AIWB until my muscle has the proper memory and, despite such muscle memory, my mind refuses to rely on muscle memory insofar as it’s able (i.e., practiced mental awareness). I understand and will employ Mr. Green’s excellent direction on hard breaking, angling the holster out, looking while reholstering, etc. If I’m ever in the same city as an AIWB workshop taught by a reputable instructor, I will take it. Even considering all of the above, I nonetheless, rationally or irrationally, have decided that I want every possible layer of negligent discharge safety that I can possibly have while employing the AIWB carry method. For me, that means all springs at rest, redundant passive safeties, and a manual-safety-decocker.
This is just my personal decision for my personal carry, not a generalized and universally applicable opinion or declaration, and does not reflect a judgment on any other person’s choice.
So, I politely ask that, if you would be so kind, responses refrain from sayings, aphorisms, anecdotes, etc., to the effect that I should have the same concerns no matter where I carry—AIWB or otherwise, or that I have no understanding of how a certain design is equally safe AIWB as my chosen design, or that proper training is the only hedge against AIWB ND, etc. Friends, I have considered this all.
What I seek is counsel on a narrow issue: Does anyone on the forum have experience with the M9A1 Compact and/or the USP Compact in AIWB? My main concern is concealability. I understand that personal body type is likely the largest factor, and you are limited in your ability to give accurate advice since you do not personally know me (see below for body-type description). However, if someone has experience with both pistols and can relate their experience I would be grateful. Otherwise, if anyone has any helpful insight into the pros and cons of each pistol for AIWB, that would be welcome.
I’m concerned about the grip width of the M9A1 Compact vs the USP Compact. The M9A1, I believe, is over 1.3" while the USP Compact is 1.17". Typically, grip width is a significant factor for me when carrying at 3:30-4:30, but perhaps there’s a nuance of AIWB that makes grip width less of a concern and I am not aware of it. Height is also a concern. Overall height of the M9A1 Compact is 5.25” vs the USP Compact’s 5.00” (reported by the respective manufacturers), but often tech specs don’t work out in actuality as one would expect.
I am not concerned with which pistol is the better duty weapon. I know many dislike the Beretta 92 series pistols for various reasons, anecdotal and otherwise, but I have sufficient time behind each platform that I’ve come to my own conclusions on the relative merits and performance of each. That said, I do not presently own and have never concealed-carried a Beretta 92 or a USP.
My only concern between these pistols is their concealability in AIWB.
I am open to, however, any suggestions one may have on other DA/SA designs with a manual safety that I perhaps have not considered. There aren't many left in the market as the design simply isn’t popular anymore. I don’t exactly love the platform myself either. I’m choosing to employ the DA/SA-manual-safety platform as a concession to my extremely high concern for AIWB safety.
As to my working and physical circumstances: I will be wearing somewhat fitted button-down shirts or semi-fitted polo shirts, untucked, with a 1.5” wilderness tactical belt w/polymer insert. I weight 185 and am 5’11” tall. I am not chiseled nor am I out of shape. I do not have a barrel chest. I’m not skinny nor overly large. From my chest down to my waist is a relatively straight drop. My pants tend to sit just below my waistline due to body type. I need to wear fitted pants, nothing baggy. I will work in my own office while sitting for much of the day. My door will usually be open and people will pop in unannounced often. Throughout part of the day I will work in close proximity to others. I will sit, stand, pick stuff up off the floor, make exaggerated arm motions, lift my arms above my head, twist at the torso, etc. Sometimes I will need to speak in front of large groups of people without the benefit of a warning. Often I will have to unholster privately and quickly (car or office) if going into a secure, non-permissive location.
For my holster, I'm planning to first try JRC's AIWB-CDA II. I'm hoping it will have a good balance of AIWB variables as I understand such variables from my research (butt/grip tuck, strength, adjustability, thinness, etc.). I had initially hoped to get 5 Shot's SME or Garrity's In-Victus but neither of those would be ready in time. I will also purchase a holster from a maker with a very short lead time so I can start training early.
Please forgive my verbosity. I perhaps erred on the side of over-clarity. Thank you in advance for your help.
(PS: If anyone wishes to take issue with my holster choice and advance their own suggestion, please do. Or if anyone has personal experience with JRC's AIWB CDA II, please relate your experience. Thank you again.)
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Originally Posted by Swenson Bobcat
