Just when you thought that IDPA was done with the stupid ideas...

[jetfire]

After the 2011Pa IDPA state match, where we ran two relays of six squads of about twelve, through eleven stages in under four hours each relay, i received complaints both that the match was too fast and that it was too slow.

It is quite impossible to make shooters happy. There is a relevant Chris Rock bit about a sex toy made out of diamond, I won't repeat it here for obvious reasons.

[Jared]

Last local USPSA match I shot was 6 stages, 1 of which was a classifier, required something on the order of 130 rounds minimum, and took my squad about 4 hours to shoot. That seems to be about average for me at that club. We had a whole squad of people that had no problem getting out and pasting and resetting steel, so even the most complex 32 round stage complete with Texas Star was back up and ready to rock pretty quickly.

[gringop]

Since this has turned into the "how to run an efficient match" thread I'll add in my thoughts as a 10 year IDPA SO.

It all depends on squad leadership.
If the SO is not loudly asking "Who is my next shooter?" 5 seconds after he has scored the last target, the match is going to run long.
If the scorekeeper is not loudly calling out the next 4 shooters in the shooting order 5 seconds after he has recorded the previous shooters scores, the match is going to run long.
If the SO is not shouting "Clear the range" 10 seconds after the last target is taped/reset, the match will run long.
If the SO does not tape at least 2 targets after they are scored, the match will run long (unless the squad gets to them before the SO can).

The SO (and scorekeeper) set's the example for the rest of the squad, if they are moving things along smartly, the squad will follow along (mostly). If they stand around BSing and picking their nose, the squad will follow suite.

For carbine matches which have multiple stages requiring "load and make ready" with both pistol and carbine, we appoint a secondary SO that manages the LAMR with the next shooter at the side berm. Once the stage is taped, reset and cleared, the secondary SO will accompany the shooter to the primary SO who now has a shooter ready to go.

There are lots of way to make matches move along efficiently. They all require good leadership.

Gringop

[cclaxton]

Since this has turned into the "how to run an efficient match" thread I'll add in my thoughts as a 10 year IDPA SO.
For carbine matches which have multiple stages requiring "load and make ready" with both pistol and carbine, we appoint a secondary SO that manages the LAMR with the next shooter at the side berm. Once the stage is taped, reset and cleared, the secondary SO will accompany the shooter to the primary SO who now has a shooter ready to go.
Gringop

Thanks for the wise observations. What a great idea on carbine matches...this really could apply to just about any kind of long gun. Although I really like the way it is generally done in 3gun: While the previous shooter is being scored and pasted, the next shooter has all mags on his person and has both long guns "muzzle-up" and is standing near the starting point or near the staging barrel where he will leave the shotgun or rifle. Once the RO/SO has confirmed the range is clear of people, he loads up your staged long gun, and the second long gun if starting with a pistol. (Note the shooter doesn't have the bring the long gun to the line cased, as is done at many DMG matches.) Then he takes you to the starting point and loads your pistol. (Although now that I think about it, loading the pistol under the supervision of a 2nd RO would save some time, too.) Also, the shotgun tubes are loaded but no round is in the chamber. Rifles are not loaded when going to the line.

Thanks for the post. I am taking on Match Director at my local club this summer and I appreciate the advice.
Cody

[Glenn E. Meyer]

The biggest slowdown we've faced lately is cranky moving targets. I've wondered about the efficacy of ones with no-shoots swinging back and forth in front of a shoot target. That ever happen? Disappearing or rotating targets - perhaps.

It was windy yesterday and a turner turned into a sail and we had to completly redo it as it jammed on the turns.

[CoThG]

Merrian Webster says there are two definitions for Perjury. One is a matter of law. The other is this: "the voluntary violation of an oath or vow either by swearing to what is untrue or by omission to do what has been promised under oath : false swearing"

They probably should have used a better word, but I have no issue because I will not violate the terms.
COdy

[JV: Personal attack removed]

[cclaxton]

Do you get a lollipop for not violating the terms and being IDPA's poster boy?

CoThG,
Please make personal comments using a PM.

Sometimes people get carried away thinking they are doing good.....

BTW, I have no problem being a poster boy for the IDPA. I am proud to be a member and strong supporter of the sport. That doesn't mean I agree with everything and IDPA has it's problems. But when you add up the credits/value and the debits/problems, IDPA is still a great sport and fun to shoot and has a lot of great people participating. It is also more friendly to new/novice shooters. And, it forces me to get better at shooting. I am not a natural talent so I have to work at it.

I hope that gives you some context of my comments.

Cody

[CoThG]

Just returned from shooting the IDPA Indoor Nationals at S&W and am more energized than ever about the incredible value of IDPA. In most of the stages it challenged me in ways that show me my strengths and my weaknesses in every area of practice. I was challenged in flashlight work, having to shoot one string in total darkness weak hand with flashlight. I was challenged with moving targets, disappearing targets which demanded that I shoot quick and accurate. I was challenged with moving while shooting in a variety of ways. I was challenged to remember which targets I had engaged. I was challenged to choose cover carefully. I was challenged to shoot in a cold wind tunnel at 20MPH. I was challenged to avoid distractions. Every stage that required use of cover had a dedicated SO watching the line of cover from about 2-3 yards where he could judge good use of cover. Penalties were given for clear violations, and not just half-a-foot. I saw NO violations of the moving while reloading rule, although there were only a couple of opportunities to break the rule. I saw quite a few penalties for engaging targets out of order because the stages were designed to give the shooter an option, and if you didn't have a good plan, you got bonus points. One of the best matches I have ever shot. And, the best indoor venue I have ever experienced, considering these were not shoothouses. There was some discussion about the Code of Conduct, but one SO working the match put it this way: The CofC was really for the SO's and Staff working the match because they wanted to make sure that the match was operated in a totally professional manner, and not like a club match. No one cared about the CofC who was shooting this match. The only discussion I had about IDPA rules was the imperfect judgement of cover calls, and even that attitude was changing as squads saw how the Cover SO made the calls.

We had a number of people DQ'd because their rounds didn't pass Chrono. Jack Ross 147gr chrono'd at 881 & 901FPS. Working theory is that Titegroup powder changes in the colder, drier climates. My theory is barometric pressure was a factor. Either way it pretty well sucked for them. The MD had a variety of factory rounds tested with the chrono equipment to verify it was tracking against known ammo varieties to make sure the chrono was calibrated.

Everyone was excited to be shooting the matches. People accepted the new rules.

On the nightsights: I found that night sights would have provided very little advantage, if any, in the stages we shot there. When you needed a flashlight, it resulted in still being able to get a sight picture without tritium. If you chose to use no flashlight in one particular stage, you needed to point-shoot and you could see the outline of the targets before they disappeared. You had to open a door, which triggered domino targets falling in the dark. You had to open the door strong hand then draw. By the time you got your gun out of the holster they were beginning to fall, so using a flashlight would have provided very little advantage and maybe slowed you down. Few people actually had tritiums or rechargeable sights. There was a lot of discussion on flashlight techniques and exchange of ideas and experiences and success stories.

For those naysayers about IDPA: I think you are blowing these rules changes entirely out of proportion given the overall value of shooting IDPA matches, especially at the Major Levels. Most people would rather shoot and focus on technique, improvement, stage planning, and just enjoying the COF. If IDPA is not your cup of tea, then move on. If you have complaints, register them respectfully with the right people, and if they don't take your suggestions, then get over it...IDPA doesn't have to agree with you!!! There are a lot of people involved in those policy decisions and due consideration is given, but it's not a public debate with IDPA. The YUKU forum is the place to make those appeals and discuss them.

In the meantime, I hope everyone will remember the value of being challenged in a COF, and that is what makes it such a valuable shooting sport.

Cody

I hope that Joyce Wilson never comes to an abrupt halt. [JV: Personal attack removed]

[Mr_White]

It is also more friendly to new/novice shooters.

In what ways do you feel like IDPA is more friendly to new/novice shooters?

[Peally]

Just in my experience it was a bit easier to follow a pre-planned stage plan than make your own (worrying about safety throughout). That plus a lower round count and I can see how it would seem more inviting to casual shooters.