IDPA Indoor Nationals in Springfield, MA...High Cap Mags

[cclaxton]

Made calls to the Massachusetts State Police and Connecticut State Police. Here is what their firearms enforcement department told me:
Massachusetts
1) As a non-resident you cannot stay overnight in the State of Mass with a handgun without a Temporary Permit. A Temporary Permit takes multiple days and must be applied-for in person. So, you can't have the handgun in your car, drive to the permit office, get the permit and be good.
2) In Mass, Mags over ten rounds are not allowed, even if you are just driving in to shoot the match and not staying overnight.
3) Mag Blocks ARE legal, and may be used to restrict the number of rounds that can be loaded into the magazine. (I pressed the point about being readily converted, and she said mag blocks are good.)
4) It would be fine to fly-in and out of a Mass airport with handguns as long as you don't stay overnight and have 10 round mags or mag-blocked mags.

Connecticut
1) As long as your mags and handgun are legal in your State of Residence, and you are legally entitled to possess it there, they are legal in Connecticut if you are staying overnight and you are "passing through" CT to and from the shooting match. You are required to keep it locked with ammo separate, per the US Title 18 requirements, since that is what is allowing the rule. Remember you are just "in transit" to or from the match, even if you stay overnight.
2) Your hotel room is considered your private residence in CT. And, there is no license required just to possess a handgun in your private residence.
3) You are allowed to possess high cap mags while you are "in transit" which means staying overnight as well. If I was shooting a match in another state where the high cap mags were allowed, that would be fine. But since my destination is Mass, and they have a hard rule against any mags over 10 rounds, so Title 18 wouldn't protect you in that case. (However the Detective I talked to said he has a hard enough time keeping up with CT laws).

So, planning on ordering mag blocks, putting them in before I leave Virginia, flying to Hartford, staying overnight in CT, driving to Springfield MA to shoot the match, returning to stay overnight in CT and then flying home from Hartford. I will keep the mag blocks in the entire time.

Finally a solution to this mess. If only Mass would just make a sporting exception....would make things a lot easier.

This is not legal advice. USe of this information is at your own risk. That being said, I am repeating what they told me.

Cody

[Mr_White]

Made calls to the Massachusetts State Police and Connecticut State Police. Here is what their firearms enforcement department told me:

Thanks for finding that out and posting the answers they gave. It is ridiculous that you have to comply with that small labyrinth.

[TheTrevor]

Cody, I admire your tenacity. Being more of a "simplest solution to the maximum number of potential issues" type myself, I'd probably just buy a bunch of 10-round mags and sell them afterwards if I didn't want them.

Ironically, this sort of thing is a lot less problematic here in CA.

[LSP972]

4) It would be fine to fly-in and out of a Mass airport with handguns as long as you don't stay overnight and have 10 round mags or mag-blocked mags.

Well, if I'm reading this correctly, you cannot "stay overnight" with an evil handgun that you brought in for sporting purposes.

Is this a one-day event?

.

[cclaxton]

Well, if I'm reading this correctly, you cannot "stay overnight" with an evil handgun that you brought in for sporting purposes.

Is this a one-day event?

.

That is what the Massachusetts officer told me when I called the Firearms Licensing Office. Since then I have had a number of people tell me that staying overnight in Mass without a Class A or Class B or Temporary permit would be allowed under Title 18 (FOPA) for the shooting match. I plan to call back again tomorrow and see if I get the same answer. Perhaps she misunderstood, or didn't really know.

The problem here is that if *some* LEO's think Title 18 doesn't cover a non-resident even staying one night, they are going to slap the cuffs on and let Managers or Prosecutors sort it out. IF the match were a two-day event (which it is not), then it might not be an issue. I will ask that question as well. There is this State Law which is ambiguous on the subject:

Section 131G. Any person who is not a resident of the commonwealth may carry a pistol or revolver in or through the commonwealth for the purpose of taking part in a pistol or revolver competition or attending any meeting or exhibition of any organized group of firearm collectors or for the purpose of hunting; provided, that such person is a resident of the United States and has a permit or license to carry firearms issued under the laws of any state, district or territory thereof which has licensing requirements which prohibit the issuance of permits or licenses to persons who have been convicted of a felony or who have been convicted of the unlawful use, possession or sale of narcotic or harmful drugs; provided, further, that in the case of a person traveling in or through the commonwealth for the purpose of hunting, he has on his person a hunting or sporting license issued by the commonwealth or by the state of his destination. Police officers and other peace officers of any state, territory or jurisdiction within the United States duly authorized to possess firearms by the laws thereof shall, for the purposes of this section, be deemed to have a permit or license to carry firearms as described in this section.

A STRICT reading of this law would only guarantee "safe passage" or "legal use" for hunting and sporting. It does not address the question of staying overnight. Mass has a requirement that all firearms be registered. It also establishes a non-resident temporary license, but you must apply IN PERSON and it will not be issued for a number of days or weeks. Because of the license requirement, you must have a license. You could argue that Title 18 protects you, but take the case of: Gregg C. Revell v. Port Authority of New York and New Jersey: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_New_York

Passengers present in airports with luggage containing unregistered handguns have run into separate legal problems. In 2005, Gregg C. Revell was traveling through Newark Airport since it was a scheduled connection between his departure city, Salt Lake City, Utah and his final destination, Allentown, Pennsylvania. But because of the missed flight to Allentown, his luggage—which included a properly checked firearm—was returned to him and he was forced to spend the night in New Jersey. When he returned to the airport the following day and checked his handgun, he was arrested for illegal possession since the gun was not registered in New Jersey, as required by state law. Mr. Revell challenged his arrest and filed suit for civil damages, but he lost his lawsuit after The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit held in Gregg C. Revell v. Port Authority of New York and New Jersey,^[26] held that (exceptions for interstate travelers) does not apply to Revell because his firearm and ammunition were readily accessible to him during his stay in New Jersey."

IF you were going to a two-day event, we might get a different answer to the question, and I will ask.

I will be staying in Connecticut, thank you.
Cody

[cclaxton]

It's Only Getting Worse...unless we help stop this madness:
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...mag-limit-etc/
Cody

[TheTrevor]

Very glad I turned down that job in Boston last year.

[TheRoland]

You are not going to get a legally binding answer talking to the nice women at the State Police or the Criminal Records Bureau or whenever you're actually reaching. MA's scheme is such that they have no idea. There is no such thing as a Temporary Permit, for example. There is a non-resident CCW, which has a confusing name like "Temporary License to Carry" but is not what you intended to ask about. Likewise, guns need not be registered; MA registers transfers.

Look here for a very detailed summary of the laws.

In summary, you're maybe fine if you're attending a shooting competiton but there is no exception for magazine size. There is no 'time limit' in the law.

As a practical matter, people just bring their guns in, shoot, stay one night, and leave. No matter what the law actually says.

Highly recommend you stop calling them. You're getting wrong answers, and you may not like it if they start trying to be helpful.

[benq]

Your better bet is to contact a MA/CT lawyers specializing in their respective state's gun laws, more specifically pro-gun lawyers. I did that before traveling through Kalifornia with the family. In my case, I could have possessed hi-cap mags but they must be disassembled(very gray area). I didn't want to chance it so I bought some 10-round mags instead.