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Thread: Why 38 Super? If 9mm x 21 and 9mm x23 Winchester already pre-existed?

  1. #11
    Member John Hearne's Avatar
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    This week's edition of Michael Bane's Podcast has a long segment on the 9x23 that covers everything you want to know: http://www.downrange.tv/blog/down-ra...chester/26241/

    FWIW, the reports of the 9x23's performance are quite impressive.

  2. #12
    Site Supporter Tamara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tpd223 View Post
    Best info I have on the .38acp, from which the Super came, is that it dates into the 1890s
    My 1902 is chambered in .38 ACP. Fortunately some companies make properly-headstamped new ammo. I don't want to get that stuff mixed up with Bobbi's .38 Super fodder.

    Interesting trivia fact: ALL .38 Super ammo is +P, since the SAAMI definition of "+P" is a higher pressure cartridge that is dimensionally identical to another extant chambering.
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  3. #13
    Member Sal Picante's Avatar
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    Wasn't part of the reason that they wanted a long cartridge (.45 ACP length) to ensure feed reliability in the already developed colt .45 ACP pistols?

  4. #14
    Very Pro Dentist Chuck Haggard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WIILSHOOT View Post
    Wasn't part of the reason that they wanted a long cartridge (.45 ACP length) to ensure feed reliability in the already developed colt .45 ACP pistols?
    The .38acp came before the .45acp

  5. #15
    Hokey / Ancient JAD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JV View Post
    I've never read that as an argument for 9x21's creation.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9%C3%9721mm


    I'm not saying Wikepedia is an authority on gun related items, but this jives with all of my other data-points.
    Yup, mea maxima culpa, written in a weak moment. X21 got what legs it used to have in the states for the reason I describe, I have heard, though I can't substantiate that. Ditto 356 TSW I dimly recall. Or it's all a groovy-bear / KriegerCleanse driven hallucination.
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  6. #16
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    I have enjoyed this thread on the 9mm/.38 auto family. Where does the .356TSW fit in?

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamara View Post
    My 1902 is chambered in .38 ACP. Fortunately some companies make properly-headstamped new ammo. I don't want to get that stuff mixed up with Bobbi's .38 Super fodder.

    Interesting trivia fact: ALL .38 Super ammo is +P, since the SAAMI definition of "+P" is a higher pressure cartridge that is dimensionally identical to another extant chambering.

    Wouldnt the existence of 9mm Glisenti therefore make all 9x19 ammo +P. And as a result 9mm +P would be +P+ . 9mm +P+ would therefore be 9mm turbo OMG!!!!


    Or maybe im being absurd on the last one
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  8. #18
    Site Supporter Tamara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigT View Post
    Wouldnt the existence of 9mm Glisenti therefore make all 9x19 ammo +P. And as a result 9mm +P would be +P+ . 9mm +P+ would therefore be 9mm turbo OMG!!!!


    Or maybe im being absurd on the last one
    There is no SAAMI spec for 9mm +P+. It's purely a marketing/CYA designation from ammunition manufacturers. (And not all ammo thus marked exceeds SAAMI specs for 9mm +P. Go figure.)
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  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamara View Post
    There is no SAAMI spec for 9mm +P+. It's purely a marketing/CYA designation from ammunition manufacturers. (And not all ammo thus marked exceeds SAAMI specs for 9mm +P. Go figure.)
    I am aware of that I was aiming more at the 9x19 Glisenti vs 9x19 Luger/Parabellum/.NATO etc dimensional similarities. The rest was an (obviously a poorly made) attempt at comedy.
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  10. #20
    Site Supporter Tamara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigT View Post
    I am aware of that I was aiming more at the 9x19 Glisenti vs 9x19 Luger/Parabellum/.NATO etc dimensional similarities. The rest was an (obviously a poorly made) attempt at comedy.
    Y'know, I don't know if there's a SAAMI spec for the Glisenti round or not? You've tickled my gun nerd now.

    I don't know that the ammunition's ever been sold commercially in this country except for small runs of Fiocchi years ago.
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